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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What is a tavern and how is it different from a restaurant? For example, I have been down to swing dances at the Graveyard Tavern before. They serve full blown meals and lots of people seem to be sitting at full-sized tables and eating. The DoR alcohol license says the business type is a tavern, so I am going to go out on a limb and say it may be off-limits for carry without the owners permission. What I am not sure about at all is when something goes from a restaurant to a tavern.

Thoughts?
 

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The title of the establishment has nothing to do with its legality. The place could be called "Drunk Off Your Ass Bar and Tavern of Ill Repute" and be a legal restaurant for carry purposes.

This is where you want to look to see if the establishment is a restaurant. https://etax.dor.ga.gov/AlcoholRetailer/Default.aspx

Also, if the establishment is open on Sunday, it's [s:2v81oy0m]a restaurant.[/s:2v81oy0m] not a bar but could be a tavern.

If the establishment has a license type of tavern, club, lounge or cabaret, it = bar, and carry would require permission from the owner.
 

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O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127 said:
Carrying weapons in unauthorized locations; penalty
(a) As used in this Code section, the term:
(1) "Bar" means an establishment that is devoted to the serving of alcoholic beverages for consumption by guests on the premises and in which the serving of food is only incidental to the consumption of those beverages, including, but not limited to, taverns, nightclubs, cocktail lounges, and cabarets.
...
(b) A person shall be guilty of carrying a weapon or long gun in an unauthorized location and punished as for a misdemeanor when he or she carries a weapon or long gun while:
...
(6) In a bar, unless the owner of the bar permits the carrying of weapons or long guns by license holders;
...
So DoR says it's a Tavern. The law says Tavern=Bar. That means you need permission from the owner...

IANAL,
Cliffhanger
 

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Mrs_Esterhouse said:
Also, if the establishment is open on Sunday, it's a restaurant.
That's not entirely accurate. Taverns can be open on Sunday, bars can't. DoR licenses things as taverns, clubs, cabarets, and all sorts of other categories other than simply "bar" or "restaurant." Most of them can be open on Sunday; many of them are prohibited without permission under current law.

Checking the DoR search engine is the best way to be sure. The list that the legislators used to write the law is the same list as alcohol licensing categories. Now, the law doesn't say that one definition is the same as the other, if you do get arrested, who knows what might happen, but it's a safe place to start. Using the DoR website is a good way to CYA, as you have an official state of Georgia entity covering you.

My current SOP is, I'll OC only if it's licensed as a restaurant and clearly operating as one. Otherwise, if it's licensed as a restaurant but primary serving alcohol, I'll CC. If it's licensed as a bar or tavern or other prohibited type of place, I choose a different place to eat if possible (unless I know the owner's given permission, but I am not aware of any places as of yet).
 

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IANAL but I'd say you need permission....Business Type: Tavern
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
BSCLibertarian said:


IANAL but I'd say you need permission....Business Type: Tavern
Thanks for posting the image!

I thought that point was already covered at least a little. In the OP, I wrote "The DoR alcohol license says the business type is a tavern" :D

The real question is a little different. Why is this a tavern and not a restaurant?

I figure this discussion might be helpful as we start talking with our representatives in preparation for the next session. We are all taking them out to lunch again, no?

Thoughts?
 

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I honestly don't know what the difference between a Bar and Tavern is.....seems like exactly the same thing to me. The fact that there are two different licenses leads me to believe the State of GA sees them as two different things....however, as far as carrying goes, you need permission in either one IMHO.....based on the language in SB 308.

(and I thought your OP was fairly clear too :))
 

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Was the 50% rule thrown out? It said that an establishment making more than 50% of its income from food was a restaurant regardless what they called it. Generally, places open on Sunday easily exceeded the 50% mark.
 

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CountryGun said:
Was the 50% rule thrown out? It said that an establishment making more than 50% of its income from food was a restaurant regardless what they called it. Generally, places open on Sunday easily exceeded the 50% mark.
50% is gone for carry purposes.
 

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Mrs_Esterhouse said:
The title of the establishment has nothing to do with its legality. The place could be called "Drunk Off Your Ass Bar and Tavern of Ill Repute" and be a legal restaurant for carry purposes.

This is where you want to look to see if the establishment is a restaurant. https://etax.dor.ga.gov/AlcoholRetailer/Default.aspx
That's a great resource, and well worth checking. One of my favorites has "bar" in its name, is open on Sundays, and has more of the "feel" of a bar than a restaurant, so I checked on that site. It's a restaurant! (WooHoo)
 

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cliffhanger said:
O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127 said:
Carrying weapons in unauthorized locations; penalty
(a) As used in this Code section, the term:
(1) "Bar" means an establishment that is devoted to the serving of alcoholic beverages for consumption by guests on the premises and in which the serving of food is only incidental to the consumption of those beverages, including, but not limited to, taverns, nightclubs, cocktail lounges, and cabarets.
...
(b) A person shall be guilty of carrying a weapon or long gun in an unauthorized location and punished as for a misdemeanor when he or she carries a weapon or long gun while:
...
(6) In a bar, unless the owner of the bar permits the carrying of weapons or long guns by license holders;
...
So DoR says it's a Tavern. The law says Tavern=Bar. That means you need permission from the owner...

IANAL,
Cliffhanger
It would appear so. If the establishment has a license type of tavern, club, lounge or cabaret, it = bar, and carry would require permission from the owner.
 

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I checked out the law, I would say you need permission from the owner just to be on the safe side.
 

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The only one that really affects me is the Brick Store Pub (Tavern) in Decatur. Twain's (Other) also may require permission. :x

The Iberian Pig says "Other" :?:

I'm pretty sure the Pig is legally a restaurant, and I'm still going to carry there.
 

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The definition of a bar should not have been changed. A bar is a place that derives most of its revenue from the sale of alcohol. A restaurant is a place that derives most of its sales from food. There are a lot of places that are now off limits without permission that were perfectly fine after HB89. Perhaps getting bar removed from the list all together or at the very least changing the definition back to 51% should be a primary goal. Almost all of your “sports†type restaurants are labeled as taverns. This means they can be open on Sunday and serve alcohol but are off limits because of the stupid new law everyone wanted. The new law was poorly written from the start. While a lot of cleaning up was done prior to its passing it still needed a lot of work. This is only one part of it that needs to be fixed.
 

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Mrs_Esterhouse said:
The only one that really affects me is the Brick Store Pub (Tavern) in Decatur. Twain's (Tavern) also requires permission. :x

The Iberian Pig says "Other" :?:

I'm pretty sure the Pig is legally a restaurant, and I'm still going to carry there.
I'm pretty sure that "Other" would also fall under the "need permission" range. If someone wanted to make a case for it the bar definition is open ended enough for them to do so. The way the law reads if it's not labeled a restaurant then it can fall under the definition of a bar. It's the includes but not limited to that will get you in trouble every time. The same wording was used in the public gathering law IIRC. So what is an "Other"? It's not a restaurant!
 

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seajay said:
the stupid new law everyone wanted.
:lol: We are much better off after the passage of SB 308 and the demise of the public gathering law, Seajay. Much. Much. Much.

Sorry it was not perfect, but nobody has given GCO dictatorial control over the legislative process - yet! :wink:
 

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seajay said:
Almost all of your “sports†type restaurants are labeled as taverns. This means they can be open on Sunday and serve alcohol but are off limits because of the stupid new law everyone wanted.
Check them out before assuming -- the four sports bars I go to are all licensed as restaurants. So, I can go there and carry and not have a cop decide that the patio outside is a "public gathering". I'm batting 1000 with the "stupid new law".
 

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RickN said:
seajay said:
Almost all of your “sports†type restaurants are labeled as taverns. This means they can be open on Sunday and serve alcohol but are off limits because of the stupid new law everyone wanted.
Check them out before assuming -- the four sports bars I go to are all licensed as restaurants. So, I can go there and carry and not have a cop decide that the patio outside is a "public gathering". I'm batting 1000 with the "stupid new law".
+1

It's surprising how many "sports bars" are licensed as a restaurant.

After playing on the DoR site, there are several places that I was expecting to be a bar, but aren't.

Good Ole Days
The Highlander
Highland Tap
Blind Willie's This one really surprised me.
OLDE BLIND DOG
 

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Adam5 said:
RickN said:
seajay said:
Almost all of your “sports†type restaurants are labeled as taverns. This means they can be open on Sunday and serve alcohol but are off limits because of the stupid new law everyone wanted.
Check them out before assuming -- the four sports bars I go to are all licensed as restaurants. So, I can go there and carry and not have a cop decide that the patio outside is a "public gathering". I'm batting 1000 with the "stupid new law".
The Highlander
Highland Tap
Been to both of those places after SB-308 while carrying. :)

Highland Tap's not open for lunch on weekdays any more, makes me very sad. Their burgers were probably the best in Atlanta, competing with H&F.
 

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ookoshi said:
Been to both of those places after SB-308 while carrying. :)

Highland Tap's not open for lunch on weekdays any more, makes me very sad. Their burgers were probably the best in Atlanta, competing with H&F.
H&F ???
 
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