Wal-Mart is a "public gathering" now?

Discussion in 'LEO Encounters' started by mzmtg, Jun 2, 2006.

  1. mzmtg

    mzmtg Active Member

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  2. EagleEye920

    EagleEye920 Member

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    I really hope there's more to why this guy was arrested! If not, this is VERY bad.

    It's already bad enough that some people have to call the cops because they see a big bad meanie gun that might "go off". Let's hope there's more to come...

    Anybody know how to find the official statements from the judge. All I've seen is what is on THR.
     

  3. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Where did all the additional details on the High Road come from, such as the Judge's statements?
     
  4. ICP_Juggalo

    ICP_Juggalo Professional Troll

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    :puke:

    That is all I can manage right now... just sickening.
     
  5. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    Magistrate's Comments

    From The High Road article linked above, this is what a judge (the same magistrate judge who signed the defendant's arrest warrant shortly after the cop arrested him and took him in? Or some other judge?) had to say about the definition of "public gathering" :

    long-time judge here in town said if you were in line with two other people at a water fountain you were at a public gathering, two or more people gathered together for a common purpose, to get water.

    I had both an experienced Officer and also the Chief of the Cobb County Police Department tell me the same thing in the early 1990s, regarding whether it was legal to have a gun while walking down a public sidewalk. Their opinion was that if you were alone, fine, but if you met a friend on the sidewalk and went walking together, then "two or more persons" have gathered in a public place for a common purpose. If you just happened to pass a stranger on the sidewalk, that would not be illegal because the people "gathered" did not have a "common purpose."

    I have no idea where they got that idea from. Maybe it's something they teach at cop conventions and seminars. Maybe it's just their layman's interpretation of the law. After all, if you didn't read Attorney General Opinions and carefully research caselaw on the subject, you would not be able to differentiate between a public place, private property accessible to the public, and a public gathering, would you? I would not. The words themselves are vague, and must be interpreted and defined to have any useful meaning to the reader.

    LESSON TO REMEMBER: Some cops think that if you agree to meet your wife in the bedroom of your home 123 Any Street for the "common purpose" of making love, you are at a public gathering. If you bring your gun into the bedroom and stick it in a dresser drawer before you get down to it, you have carried a deadly weapon "to" or "while at" the public gathering. For that matter, some cops interpret the law to mean that if you go plinking at a local target range with a group of friends, you have violated the law. You are part of a group who have gathered for a common purpose, and you are not a competitor in an "officially sanctioned" target match or tournament.

    [/i]
     
  6. ICP_Juggalo

    ICP_Juggalo Professional Troll

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    Just got off the phone with Belinda @ the Neal Boortz Show. I asked if Neal would speak with me about Georgia's awful carry laws. She said no that he can't do that since they are a national syndicated radio show...

    Whatever the hell that means :roll:
     
  7. wwomack

    wwomack New Member

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    You might have better luck calling between 9 and 10 as he's mostly just on in Atlanta at that point. From 10am after is when he starts on all the syndicated stations. 9-10 is kind of his local stories hour.
     
  8. Gunstar1

    Gunstar1 Administrator

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    Wouldn't the McDonalds case disprove that?
     
  9. Gunstar1

    Gunstar1 Administrator

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    this is what I am talking about:
     
  10. Woody_the_Infidel

    Woody_the_Infidel New Member

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    Is it possible to get the NRA, SAF, or GOA involved in getting our silly carry laws changed?
     
  11. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Re: Magistrate's Comments

    Yeah, that is what I am talking about! Is the poster on the High Road a witness to the actual court proceeding? Anybody know?

    Is the arrestee still in jail?

    mzmtg, are you a member over there, and, if so, wyould you find out for me?

    Thanks.
     
  12. GAGunOwner

    GAGunOwner Active Member

    GFL holders have to put up with such a restrictive set of off-limits places, it gets me so angry to see "one of us" arrested in one of the few places that exist that are not off-limits by some geek judge who obviously hasn't read the law and by some Nazi or idiot Kop.

    Why even have a license if you can't take it anywhere? I believe that you can't carry anywhere in this state without the chance that you could be arrested.

    To be honest I think I would rather Georgia do away wth it's CCW law. Just tell the truth Georgia; Why issue a license if it is good for nothing? Just be like Illinois and not have one.

    End of rant.
     
  13. Woody_the_Infidel

    Woody_the_Infidel New Member

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    I think it's better than nothing. I pretty much carry everywhere i go except the restaurants we go to on the weekends and an occasional gun show.
     
  14. Molon Labe

    Molon Labe New Member

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    Then you've probably broken the law numerous times. I love our law, it makes criminals out of honest citizens.
     
  15. Woody_the_Infidel

    Woody_the_Infidel New Member

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    No. I am aware of where i can and cannot legally carry. I just don't go to those places often. I do not go in to government buildings, use public transportation, etc.
     
  16. Molon Labe

    Molon Labe New Member

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    My point is that you could step into a public gathering without even knowing it because the law is so vague. This guy went to walmart, where I've been man y times, and got arrested for violating the public gathering clause.
     
  17. artz

    artz New Member

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    Thats B/S !......

    I know where that Walmart on Bullsboro BLVD. in Newnan is at.
    I was just in there not too long ago, and yes....I was packin' my Taurus 85 in a nemesis pocket holster. Of course, I wasn't "busted" with it either.
    I don't know if the person was guilty of a threat of some sort or like to brag and show , or ?
     
  18. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    PUBLIC GATHERING

    OKAY, so we all agree the "public gathering" phrase in our law is just about useless. Some of the examples are clear enough to understand (not that I support banning guns in all those places, but at least it's not vague when the law says I can't carry in a place that serves booze to consume there), but even some of the examples are vague and confusing and begging for further definition (e.g. sporting events-- would that include meeting five members of your neighborhood running group for a 5-mile jog together?)

    Now I realize that the BEST SOLUTION to the problem is to just get rid of the current law entirely, or at least make it non-applicable to people with a GFL permit. But that solution fundamentally changes the law. It's not a refinement or a more accurate restatement of the law, but rather a drastic revision that makes many more activities clearly legal that are presently clearly illegal.

    What, I ask, would be the best way to rewrite 16-11-127 to capture the IDEA behind it and give it as much force and effect as possible while only refining the law enough to de-criminalize those close cases which the legislatures of the last 30 years did not envision or predict when they had the opportunity to revise the statute? Can we come up with some alternative words and phrases that define what is a "public gathering" is that would, for example, include professional NBA basketball games without having to resort to a supplemental list that has an entry for "sporting events?" Or should we give up on the "public gathering" phrase entirely and simply come up with a list of specific types of establishments and gathering places, and say that you cannot carry in any of them?

    How about a definition of "public gathering" that requires BOTH a dense concentration of people (lots of people in small area) and a common purpose --- one that involves either interaction with each other or being an audience for a presentation, movie, or performance of some kind? This way, a shopping mall would not be off-limits even when crowded because the people are shopping for different items at many different stores throughout the mall, and if you and five co-workers agreed to meet at Cold Stone Creamery in the mall at 7 pm to get ice cream cones and shakes together, this would not be a "public gathering" because of the small number of people who shared this "common purpose."

    I suppose one could argue that because there is really no rhyme or reason to the current law, and because it makes no logical sense to ban guns from church functions but not (explicitly) movie theaters, or to ban guns from restaurants that serve alcohol but not those that don't when the legislature has already made it illegal to discharge a gun while intoxicated and could easily make it a crime to handle or carry a gun while intoxicated.... how can we "clarify" the law without greatly expanding or restricting the number of places a GFL holder can legally "pack" right now? Who can even say with confidence that they KNOW what places are off-limits to gun-packing civilians right now? Unless you are talking about a place that is specifically named in the statute itself or one of the very few appellate cases applying this law, isn't it really up in the air?
     
  19. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    This has me a little angry. :x

    Was he charged with a violation of OCGA 16-11-127, or not?