[Bkite]

How in the blazing saddle did you get that? No one has those answers. Do you actually read my replies? No one knows. This is a unique situation in human history, against a backdrop of political, and economic interests. If we want to keep driving, heating, cooling, entertaining, fighting, and a host of other activities requiring cheap energy, we're either going to have to hope the shale fields hold out, import, come up with a reasonable alternate, or cut back. And yes I realize Lockheed Skunk Works has promised a marketable fission device in 5 years. They've been saying that every year for the past 10 years.
The point is, I'm up for solutions. I don't GAF if they're red/blue solutions. Whatever that means. Humanity is all in it together. I wish I was well enough educated to have a meaningful input. Until then? SCIENCE.

And emotional histrionics apparently

 

[45_Fan]

Who has lead the charge on cleaning up the environment?
Who has put in more money in the coffers?
Again, what did the dinosaur's die of? Apocalyptic Climate change maybe?

The KT extinction event was a meteor impact that left extensive geological evidence.

 

[45_Fan]

And emotional histrionics apparently

Are you going to dialog or just agitate?

 

[Bkite]

Are you going to dialog or just agitate?

Quit being so biasedly miopic. My response was appropriate. You are not some type of mediator. You definitely do not have the qualifications.
His WTF and other childish references to cursing warrant the emotional histrionics comment.

 

[cbrer]

So are you going to debate the point? Your response was a dodge. Characterizing my response in no way furthers the discussion.

I have to admit though "emotional histrionics" did crack me up.

 

[Bkite]

Joe Biden, consistent with his track record of putting himself, his family and China first, will get us back into the Paris agreement.
President Trump right to leave bad Paris Agreement: Sen. John Barrasso (usatoday.com)

 

[Bkite]

Rewards for criminals. Legal status and free everything. If you were trying to overwhelm an already greatly burdened, teetering on the precipice, system, what would you do to deliver the death blow?
Joe Biden: Amnesty for Everyone Who Was Here on January 1 (breitbart.com)

 

[HJB]

Rewards for criminals. Legal status and free everything. If you were trying to overwhelm an already greatly burdened, teetering on the precipice, system, what would you do to deliver the death blow?
Joe Biden: Amnesty for Everyone Who Was Here on January 1 (breitbart.com)

Makes me want to throw up !

 

[45_Fan]

Rewards for criminals. Legal status and free everything. If you were trying to overwhelm an already greatly burdened, teetering on the precipice, system, what would you do to deliver the death blow?
Joe Biden: Amnesty for Everyone Who Was Here on January 1 (breitbart.com)

From a less alarmist source, it's going to be an effort and not a shoo-in.
https://apnews.com/article/joe-bide...barack-obama-5274d5912b062989cc4f2856f3741cd6

Benefit eligibility still requires 5 years of legal residency* meaning 5 years of taxes before costs, so that's not going to be a tipping point.

I'm glad to see an increase in white collar visas on the table too. Our tech industry is struggling with brain-drain as jobs can't be filled fast enough in the US and companies are having to send high dollar development work to wherever it can get done. It is much better for the US economy to have worker on visas here paying taxes and spending money in the local economy than writing blank checks to build (eventually competing) high tech work forces elsewhere.

*https://immigrationforum.org/article/fact-sheet-immigrants-and-public-benefits/

 

[Bkite]

From a less alarmist source, it's going to be an effort and not a shoo-in.
https://apnews.com/article/joe-bide...barack-obama-5274d5912b062989cc4f2856f3741cd6

Benefit eligibility still requires 5 years of legal residency* meaning 5 years of taxes before costs, so that's not going to be a tipping point.

I'm glad to see an increase in white collar visas on the table too. Our tech industry is struggling with brain-drain as jobs can't be filled fast enough in the US and companies are having to send high dollar development work to wherever it can get done. It is much better for the US economy to have worker on visas here paying taxes and spending money in the local economy than writing blank checks to build (eventually competing) high tech work forces elsewhere.

*https://immigrationforum.org/article/fact-sheet-immigrants-and-public-benefits/

Illegal immigrants are a net drain on the economy using far more taxpayer funds than paying in. Free education, health care, snap benefits etc etc

 

[Bkite]

like the immigrationreform website cited above, the NY comPost is a left leaning and is, genereally, therefore a lying/inaccurate source. They do report some things sometimes without too much spin
Layoffs hitting more white collar jobs - and even health care workers (nypost.com)

and there is this.

CEOs Keep 1 Million Indian Graduates in U.S. Jobs, Legally (breitbart.com)
and this

DOJ Accuses Facebook Of Offering High-Paying, White-Collar Jobs To Foreign Workers And Excluding Americans From Applying (forbes.com)

 

[Nemo]

I have to admit though "emotional histrionics" did crack me up.

Me too, but it is quite accurate.

Nemo

 

[45_Fan]

like the immigrationreform website cited above, the NY comPost is a left leaning and therefore lying/inaccurate source.
Layoffs hitting more white collar jobs - and even health care workers (nypost.com)

and there is this.

CEOs Keep 1 Million Indian Graduates in U.S. Jobs, Legally (breitbart.com)
and this

DOJ Accuses Facebook Of Offering High-Paying, White-Collar Jobs To Foreign Workers And Excluding Americans From Applying (forbes.com)

There is a land grab coming and it'll happen whether we're in front of it or ground to dust under it. The reason our economy didn't completely fold over last summer is that a portion of our service industry was able to shift to other jobs, mainly (warehouse or grocery) pickers and delivery drivers. While that is good today, huge chunks of that can be automated on a 3-5 year scale and I expect most of our logistics to follow on a 5-10 year scale. Or to put it in human terms, robots will be running our just-in-time logistics, from container handling, to long haul trucking, to local deliver to warehouse workers. No doubt humans will still be in the loop, but for those types of jobs, it wouldn't surprise me to see a 90% reduction in human workers. Of the remainder, there is no reason why robot supervisors would need to physically be present in the US for the same reason we run drones in the Middle East out of shipping containers in the American southwest.

That may sound like gloom and doom but there will be a high tech jobs boom that goes with it and whoever has the development and innovation headcount will be patenting, licensing, and exporting ideas and services to the rest of the world for at least a decade. If we're not absolutely out front, we're going to, economically, be sucking wind for a long time. The change coming will look like hunter gatherers unexpectedly coming up on walled cities of established agrarian communities.

 

[Bkite]

There is a land grab coming and it'll happen whether we're in front of it or ground to dust under it. The reason our economy didn't completely fold over last summer is that a portion of our service industry was able to shift to other jobs, mainly (warehouse or grocery) pickers and delivery drivers. While that is good today, huge chunks of that can be automated on a 3-5 year scale and I expect most of our logistics to follow on a 5-10 year scale. Or to put it in human terms, robots will be running our just-in-time logistics, from container handling, to long haul trucking, to local deliver to warehouse workers. No doubt humans will still be in the loop, but for those types of jobs, it wouldn't surprise me to see a 90% reduction in human workers. Of the remainder, there is no reason why robot supervisors would need to physically be present in the US for the same reason we run drones in the Middle East out of shipping containers in the American southwest.

That may sound like gloom and doom but there will be a high tech jobs boom that goes with it and whoever has the development and innovation headcount will be patenting, licensing, and exporting ideas and services to the rest of the world for at least a decade. If we're not absolutely out front, we're going to, economically, be sucking wind for a long time. The change coming will look like hunter gatherers unexpectedly coming up on walled cities of established agrarian communities.

There are some predictions of AI taking over those jobs. Wonder why that technology hasn't come into being before?

 

[45_Fan]

There are some predictions of AI taking over those jobs. Wonder why that technology hasn't come into being before?

I think it was perception problems.

For office work, once the need for paper and filing was transcended, there really was no need for businesses to spend the money on white collar office spaces. Most businesses still maintained physical attendance policies though. I think the COVID lockdowns proved people were still productive even if not physically present and lots of businesses suddenly saw cost savings.

I'll say similar realizations were had about grocery delivery even though ideas like curbside pickup and WebVan had lackluster consumer adoption rather than a lack of management following. After the lockdowns though, I think some portion of the population may never go back to normal grocery shopping.

The automation of warehouse work for containers and pallets is basically there. Sub-pallet sizes for fulfillment services has been getting attention over the last decade with Amazon being a front runner. When that gets worked out, it'll be equally applicable to groceries. Some robots will run in refrigerators and freezers but they'll not be programmed to notice the difference. When it happens, Kroger/Walmart/etc. could open fulfillment-only locations and save on the "customer friendly" aspects because the robots won't leave bad reviews.

Everything after that is a self-driving vehicle problem and that's only a few years off. Automated hand trucks will be adapted from the warehouse experience and work like a miniature version of a brick or sod delivery forklift.

 

[Bkite]

I think it was perception problems.

For office work, once the need for paper and filing was transcended, there really was no need for businesses to spend the money on white collar office spaces. Most businesses still maintained physical attendance policies though. I think the COVID lockdowns proved people were still productive even if not physically present and lots of businesses suddenly saw cost savings.

I'll say similar realizations were had about grocery delivery even though ideas like curbside pickup and WebVan had lackluster consumer adoption rather than a lack of management following. After the lockdowns though, I think some portion of the population may never go back to normal grocery shopping.

The automation of warehouse work for containers and pallets is basically there. Sub-pallet sizes for fulfillment services has been getting attention over the last decade with Amazon being a front runner. When that gets worked out, it'll be equally applicable to groceries. Some robots will run in refrigerators and freezers but they'll not be programmed to notice the difference. When it happens, Kroger/Walmart/etc. could open fulfillment-only locations and save on the "customer friendly" aspects because the robots won't leave bad reviews.

Everything after that is a self-driving vehicle problem and that's only a few years off. Automated hand trucks will be adapted from the warehouse experience and work like a miniature version of a brick or sod delivery forklift.

So less jobs for some Americans then correct? Need for other type of workers increase correct? Wonder if the infrastructure gobbledygook will include expeditious education for American workers? Wonder if all this that you suggest will result in more Americans over illegals, foreign Visa holders etc will be employed? Will it be more of the same old song and dance?

 

[45_Fan]

So less jobs for some Americans then correct? Need for other type of workers increase correct? Wonder if the infrastructure gobbledygook will include expeditious education for American workers? Wonder if all this that you suggest will result in more Americans over illegals, foreign Visa holders etc will be employed? Will it be more of the same old song and dance?

If some Americans choose to stay stagnant, yes, they'll be left behind. It will look like they're out of work shoeing horses after Henry Ford changed How Things Are Now if they're not open to adapting to that change. I don't think that the government has a responsibility to force people to change nor pick up the tab for their (re)education though. Not trying to be blunt or unsympathetic about it either; I'm outrunning the wheat combine in my field knowing I've got limited time left. If I can keep ahead of it for another decade, I retire well. If not, I pay for healthcare by asking if you'd like fries with that. Either way, that's on me...not you, the government, or some guy that just got here that doesn't speak the language have a network nor a specialized skill set.

 

[Phil1979]

I think things will pretty much be the same with some window differences along the way, until things really change with the coming mark people will be required to have in their forehead or right hand in order to buy or sell.

But don't take that mark, or you will forever be lost with no hope of salvation. (see Revelation 14)

 

[Schweisshund]

Your characterization of Biden's Presidency is factually untrue. I trust judges a lot more than politicians. And no way is Biden the dream candidate (as far as I'm concerned). He's just a step back from the cliff of Trump.

Did you read through the EO Trump signed 2 days ago?

Did you read through it? A Judge was attacked by a person posing as a Federal Express employee ...her son killed and husband injured. She had recently taken a money laundering case involving Jeffrey Epstein.

 

[Schweisshund]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presiden...rcement-officers-judges-prosecutors-families/