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I can do it quicker.

Transgender individuals are mentally ill.
 

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Besides becoming the first animated corpse to hold the title of President of the United States, Creepy Joe also became the first president to issue a presidential proclamation to "honor" these sick people on their special day yesterday. Don't forget that Creepy also reversed President Trump's ban on transgenders serving openly in the military shortly after his inauguration.

 

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Don't forget that Creepy also reversed President Trump's ban on transgenders serving openly in the military shortly after his inauguration.

Considering the terror that transgender people seem to strike into the hearts of conservatives, maybe they're the ideal soldiers for fighting Islamic terrorists? ;)

The whole "transgender" issue is the king (well, or queen, or...) of "news that distracts" on both sides of the aisle.

I mean, think - has your life ever been impacted even remotely by the existence of transgender people? I don't think I've every even met one, and I live and work in the "Berkeley South" part of Atlanta (the Midtown-Druid Hills corridor).

I mean, please, tell me of your harrowing encounter with a transgender person. I'm just not seeing "0.01%" of the population as something to actually spend time on, either to support them (I don't, because it's not important) or oppose them (I don't, because it's not important.)

DH
 

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I don't think I've every even met one...
Neither have I and I prefer to keep it that way. That doesn't mean they may not have some direct or more likely indirect impact on my life. Regardless, I have no need to explain why I don't care for these people just like I don't ask someone else to explain why they do. I'm not going to play that silly game. But I'll stand by my assertion that transgenderism is a mental disorder. A view also held by many medical professionals.
 
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...I'll stand by my assertion that transgenderism is a mental disorder. A view also held by many medical professionals.
I think it's worth noting that psychology isn't really a science; for the most part, its experimental methods are too limited to produce useful theory. Anything really structural or predictive (like actual neurological problems which affect behavior, such as ADHD or depression) has been mostly migrating to neuroscience (which IS a science.)

I'm not aware of "gender" showing up on CTAs or MRIs. A brain is a brain. So really "gender" is probably not a very useful idea. I mean, there's biological sex (which is obvious), and there are occasional genetic misfires resulting in abnormal expressions of biological sex, but that's it.

Is transgenderism a mental disorder? Maybe. But then, so is probably every "identification". I identify as a few things, for example, I call myself "a physicist". I wasn't born that way - it's a decision I made, and I altered myself (I got a physics education) to align myself with a vision of my identity. You can stick me in a machine and it's never going to tell you I'm a physicist, so what gives? No evidence. Pretty crazy!

But again, there are 17,100 physicists in the USA. That's 0.005% of the population. Hardly worthy of a political movement.

DH
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Gender does show up on chromosomes. X and Y things. XX or XY. We are talking humans here. No need to get into the ZW system in birds, reptiles and some others.

Yes there are XO and XXY people. But those are effectively defective and as your physicist count argument, irrelevant.

In the final analyis there are basically 2 genders, sexes or whatever you want to call it. Because with all living creatures there are 2 basic functions. Survive and Reproduce. One creature can survive on its own. It cannot reproduce on its own. Science requires 2 participants to reproduce.

2 females or 2 males cannot reproduce.

That leaves everything to the question of Nurture or Nature. Not genetic (cannot reproduce with 2 males or 2 females) so its not Nature. So the only other option is Nurture.

It is the way that person was raised/taught/learned while aging causing the mental defect. Or are girls just still too oogie to bother with?

I personally know girls are not oogie so it must be mental defect.

Nemo
 

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That's not gender. It's sex.

Gender used to be a grammar term.

This (gender is sex) meaning is very recent in common usage, introduced mainly by psychologists. We all hear it so much now all our lives that we accept that as its current meaning.
 

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In the journals of the American Physiological Society, gender was first introduced into a title in 1982, whereas sex had been used since the early 1920s. It was not until the mid-1990s that use of the term gender began to exceed use of the term sex in APS titles, and today gender more the doubles that of sex (Table 1)

 

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That's not gender. It's sex.

Gender used to be a grammar term.

This (gender is sex) meaning is very recent in common usage, introduced mainly by psychologists. We all hear it so much now all our lives that we accept that as its current meaning.
Further proof or at least strong supporting evidence of my argument. As well as moe's argument that viewing gender as different from sex is a mental defect.

Nemo
 

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I think it's worth noting that psychology isn't really a science...
Ya know, this sounds like the start of a disinformation campaign on your part to claim that those medical professionals who consider transgenderism to be a mental disorder shouldn't be listened to and they should be shushed away into a dark corner never to be heard or seen again. Much like the disinformation campaign we've all been subjected to over the past year by medical professionals who disagreed with the "official coronavirus narrative" that's destroyed the world's social and economic systems. Sorry, not buying the bullshit this time around. (n)
 

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Ya know, this sounds like the start of a disinformation campaign on your part to claim that those medical professionals who consider transgenderism to be a mental disorder shouldn't be listened to and they should be shushed away into a dark corner never to be heard or seen again. Much like the disinformation campaign we've all been subjected to over the past year by medical professionals who disagreed with the "official coronavirus narrative" that's destroyed the world's social and economic systems. Sorry, not buying the bullshit this time around. (n)
No, I'm saying this isn't a scientific issue. On either side.

You have the Left pointing to ultra rare edge cases like hermaphrodism, or even sex-swaps in non-human species, to "prove" that "gender" is somehow fluid. Okay, sure, there are genetic anomalies, but maybe that's 1% of "trans" people, tops. Trans people are trans because they want to be; they should take a humanist, civil-liberties approach, not misuse "science".

Then the Right tries to go with the "mental disorder" thing. Sorry, but if you put a trans person in a CTA or MRI, you're not going to find abnormalities. Am EEG will be normal. An autopsy will be normal. You can actually see how messed up the brains of crazy people are under imaging... trans people are normal people who've made (IMHO) a weird decision. It's no different than furries, or those Trekkies who wear the fake ears - weird, but not clinically abnormal.

Here's what's going on:

People are either male (XY) or female (XX). For various reasons, we have a set of traditional roles and traits which happen to be culturally associated with one of the other, and we call these "masculine" or "feminine". Some folks want to be on the other team, and it just so happens to be easier nowadays than ever. Not my cup of tea, and not something I'd recommend to anyone, but whatever.

My "ask" is that they do this on their own (I don't want to subsidize it) and they can't go in and dominate women's sports. If they want my respect, fine, as long as they earn it; that holds for everyone. Will I labor for their rights and so on? No, they can handle that themselves. Nor will I oppose them.

That's as much thought as I'm willing to expend on it.

DH
 

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There are well known physical differences between male and female human brains. They differ both in overall size and differences in the development of key structural areas. I’ll also wager that there are significant and obvious differences between them apparent in a functional MRI or other advanced imager that can visualize neuronal activity and patterns.

It’d be really interesting to see some large scale fMRI comparative studies done on gay, trans, and heterosexual individuals. I bet they’ve been done but won’t see the light of day for a very long time, if ever. The publishers would get the Bell Curve treatment x1,000,000,000,000.

Personally, I think a majority of the trans stuff is a combination of deliberately induced mass psychosis aided by endocrine disrupting contaminants that are pervasive in the western diet & lifestyle. My wife and I both work in fields that study or deal with toxics in the environment. The current methods of certifying a compound or mixture as “safe” for use are wholly inadequate. Some of them are so bad they exhibit toxic effects in organisms at the low parts per trillion level. Folks, we couldn’t even detect stuff at those levels up to a few years ago. Oh, and they’re in just about EVERYTHING. Why do you think low T is such a huge crisis in men’s health and all the women are on SSRI’s?
 

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There are well known physical differences between male and female human brains.
Well you just incurred the wrath of the Alyssa Milanos of the world! :ROFLMAO:
 
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Body Dimorphism is a real thing. Many, if not most people experience discomfort with their body's sexual development during puberty. Pretty much everyone experiences curiosity about the opposite sex, also during puberty. This is a normal part of human development, not a disease to be treated with life-altering chemicals and surgery. Most people outgrow these feelings as they progress through puberty and young adulthood. Some do not. We are told that we must "affirm" these beliefs as an anti-suicide measure or we are against "scientific mental health". We are told to ignore research from the earliest sex-swap surgeries performed in Sweden that shows a 20x (20 times, not 20 percent) increase in suicide after the age of 50. We are not allowed to have a public square discussion about such topics our our reputations and livelihoods will be threatened. (Shut Up, they explained). The only potential ally on the left I see are the feminists/lesbians (like many old-school lesbian athletes) who realize hormones and surgery are really just advanced LARP (Live-Action Role Play) and do not actually transform a man into a woman, especially when it comes to athletic competitions.
 
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