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They'll be loyal to the other members of their unit, most likely. There were a few folks I served with who's status was maybe a little iffy, but they made good soldiers. Some were duds just like a random sample of any population.

I'm ok with leaving the decision up to the SecDef.
 

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After all the democrat rhetoric about keeping jobs in America, now they want to farm out our defense to illegals to keep from paying a higher wage.
 

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After all the democrat rhetoric about keeping jobs in America, now they want to farm out our defense to illegals to keep from paying a higher wage.
Open up them H-1B visas!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
They'll be loyal to the other members of their unit, most likely. There were a few folks I served with who's status was maybe a little iffy, but they made good soldiers. Some were duds just like a random sample of any population.

I'm ok with leaving the decision up to the SecDef.
not every random sample includes people who care so little for the laws of our once great Nation to sneak in like criminals. I agree with the duds part
 

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Just turn all border patrol stations into Ellis Islands and get back to traditional American values, rather than create endless bureaucratic obstacles to immigration. But for those who are already here, maybe we need to get back to traditional conservative values that Reagan championed.
I believe in the idea of amnesty for those who have put down roots and lived here, even though sometime back they may have entered illegally.
We need to eschew these populist/nationalist demagogues that predicate their rhetoric on cynicism for American's ability to compete globally.

But as for the army, give these people a chance at fast track citizenship if they agree to serve the country for a certain number of years, say four years, and renounce their old citizenship, loyalty would not be in question.
 

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give these people a chance at fast track citizenship if they agree to serve the country for a certain number of years, say four years, and renounce their old citizenship, loyalty would not be in question.
Because no one Jihadist would ever lie on a form to gain access to 105mm shells or a fighter-bomber....
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Because no one Jihadist would ever lie on a form to gain access to 105mm shells or a fighter-bomber....
That's right. When people use the "well they haven't broke the law since they broke the law" argument, I just scratch my head. To me it just means that their morals are low enough to continually lie cheat and steal from the American taxpayer to get their way. I don't think I want those types "protecting" America.
 

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Because no one Jihadist would ever lie on a form to gain access to 105mm shells or a fighter-bomber....
American gang members join up to get access to weapons. The army is pretty competent at weeding people out.

But this is just as much a red herring as the possibility of a transvestite molesting a kid in a bathroom. Just because the possibility theoretically exists, doesn't mean it's actually a problem.

Stealing weapons from the military is already against the law, maybe we also need a law against lying on forms as to why you are actually joining..... oh wait that is already against the law.

What the hell, let's make a new law anyway....
 

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American gang members join up to get access to weapons. The army is pretty competent at weeding people out.

But this is just as much a red herring as the possibility of a transvestite molesting a kid in a bathroom. Just because the possibility theoretically exists, doesn't mean it's actually a problem.

Stealing weapons from the military is already against the law, maybe we also need a law against lying on forms as to why you are actually joining..... oh wait that is already against the law.

What the hell, let's make a new law anyway....
As usual, you simply aren't capable of responding without strawmen, vacuous hyperbole, and other nonsense.

People joining the military for training and access isn't a red herring. As you pointed out, it's a real problem that exists today. Your suggestion is that since we cannot control that problem, we should not concern ourselves with this one.

Your statement that "the army is pretty competent at weeding people out" is pulled from your nether regions without a single fact to support it. If it had a basis in fact, the gang problem wouldn't exist on the scale it does.

And your hyperbole about laws is simply ridiculous. Laws seek to curb behavior with words. This is not merely words, but affirmative steps taken to prevent access to a group who poses a real and credible threat. One can easily lie about their motivation on a form. One cannot easily lie about their citizenship to a federal employee who will verify your credentials.

But please, don't let the reality get in the way of your condescending little rants....
 

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Can you point a single case of a 'jihadist' mole, under the guise of an illegal alien, infiltrating our military, stealing weapons, (specifically 105mm shells or a fighter bomber) and delivering them to terrorists groups?

I am sure the possibility theoretically exists, just like there is a possibility of a transvestite molesting children in a public restroom.

I am looking but I can't find a single case of someone stealing a fighter bomber and handing it to a terrorist group. But then I tried to narrow that search to those that had crossed the border illegally. Maybe you can point me to the case you had in mind when you wrote that.


Now who is engaged in hyperbole.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Can you point a single case of a 'jihadist' mole, under the guise of an illegal alien, infiltrating our military, stealing weapons, (specifically 105mm shells or a fighter bomber) and delivering them to terrorists groups?

I am sure the possibility theoretically exists, just like there is a possibility of a transvestite molesting children in a public restroom.

I am looking but I can't find a single case of someone stealing a fighter bomber and handing it to a terrorist group. But then I tried to narrow that search to those that had crossed the border illegally. Maybe you can point me to the case you had in mind when you wrote that.

Now who is engaged in hyperbole.
people who broke the law to get into the US. should be a no brainer to most folks.
 

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Can you point a single case of a 'jihadist' mole, under the guise of an illegal alien, infiltrating our military, stealing weapons, (specifically 105mm shells or a fighter bomber) and delivering them to terrorists groups?

I am sure the possibility theoretically exists, just like there is a possibility of a transvestite molesting children in a public restroom.

I am looking but I can't find a single case of someone stealing a fighter bomber and handing it to a terrorist group. But then I tried to narrow that search to those that had crossed the border illegally. Maybe you can point me to the case you had in mind when you wrote that.

Now who is engaged in hyperbole.
Another red herring. The absence of evidence, especially in criminal behavior, is not the evidence of absence.

It is a KNOWN problem that violent people join the US military for access to training, tactics, and weapons. That much is not disputable.

What you are suggesting is that it is unrealistic to believe that enemies of the US, who can easily pass for Hispanic, would employ these same strategies to gain an advantage if we allow poorly documented workers to enlist. I'm sorry, but that assertion is absurd.

And while you are suggesting that a KNOWN problem isn't a problem, you're also suggesting that with a simple pledge their "loyalty would not be in question."

Your argument is so absurd that there is no way this is anything but trolling.

A lot of value seems to be placed in having no brains.... :shakehead:
Yep, 100% trolling. Have you considered a hobby?
 

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not every random sample includes people who care so little for the laws of our once great Nation to sneak in like criminals. I agree with the duds part
That wasn't my experience when I wore my country's uniform. Your experience may have been different. I'll make allowances for that.
 

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American gang members join up to get access to weapons. The army is pretty competent at weeding people out.

But this is just as much a red herring as the possibility of a transvestite molesting a kid in a bathroom. Just because the possibility theoretically exists, doesn't mean it's actually a problem.

Stealing weapons from the military is already against the law, maybe we also need a law against lying on forms as to why you are actually joining..... oh wait that is already against the law.

What the hell, let's make a new law anyway....
Many people are not aware of that but they have found countless gang members joining for the training.

I believe with illegal aliens their loyalty is not to the united states but the third world countries they come from. Notice all the Mexican flags at rallys demanding amnesty?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Many people are not aware of that but they have found countless gang members joining for the training.

I believe with illegal aliens their loyalty is not to the united states but the third world countries they come from. Notice all the Mexican flags at rallys demanding amnesty?
I believe it would be to some kind of combined UN force or some such. I mean look at all the anti American anti Constitution crap being pushed loudly these days. There are large blocks who think that America's expansion past the original 13 colonies was wrong and that that land should all be given back.
 

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That wasn't my experience when I wore my country's uniform. Your experience may have been different. I'll make allowances for that.
I presume that country was the USA?

Nemo
 

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they've always let foreign nationals join as far back as i can remember. you don't even have too speak english. they put you in an english crash course before basic. the part where they're illegals may be new though.

they also train foreign militaries. they have offices and training grounds right there in GA on ft. benning.
 

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I presume that country was the USA?

Nemo
Yep. I served with a CW3 that was a Canadian citizen. He enlisted during Vietnam, went to OCS and climbed the ladder to O-3, got RIF'd back to E-6, made Warrant Officer and was doing pretty well. I don't remember his loyalty ever being an issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Yep. I served with a CW3 that was a Canadian citizen. He enlisted during Vietnam, went to OCS and climbed the ladder to O-3, got RIF'd back to E-6, made Warrant Officer and was doing pretty well. I don't remember his loyalty ever being an issue.
I do not doubt one word you say. I do however believe that this is a far different world and that there are those who would view Christian, Conservative gun owners, who believe in American exceptionalism and American sovereignty as being an obstacle to larger goals, and who would support UN efforts to eliminate that obstacle if the situation turned bad enough.

I do not believe the main stream media would be quick to publicize any story where illegals were found to be involved in subversion or espionage although there does exist that obvious threat. Again, thinking that illegals would never be involved in that borders on complete gullibility.
 
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