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Had an argument with someone today about respect for our flag. Apparently our flag doesn't symbolize freedom or have any special meaning. People like this really get my blood boiling. How many soldiers have had a flag draped over their coffin? Why do we bother to pledge allegiance to the flag?

This person tried to explain that the flag doesn't represent what it used to. Apparently every war we've been in since the revolutionary war has only been for economic reasons and many of our soldiers died without honor or reason. (Yes, this person actually said this)

Freedom is wasted on some people, and sometimes it's just not worth arguing.

Trivia: Why do you never perform an about face when carrying the flag?
 

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"No taxation without representation", the Stamp Act, the Tea Act, what makes him think that the Revolutionary War was without an economic basis? Wars are seldom fought for one, shining, singular reason. Most wars encompass a whole slew of reasons, some better than others.

As for the flag not having any special meaning or symbology that's just idiocy. It's just as much a symbol of the United States as the cross is a symbol of Christianity, or the swoosh is a symbol of Nike shoes.
 

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Quest50 said:
...Snip... Trivia: Why do you never perform an about face when carrying the flag?
Just a guess, but the flag, when carried in a parade or other procession should always be in the front in a line of several flags, or to the right of a second flag. If one does an about face, that will change the position of the flag.
 

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GotUrBack said:
Quest50 said:
...Snip... Trivia: Why do you never perform an about face when carrying the flag?
Just a guess, but the flag, when carried in a parade or other procession should always be in the front in a line of several flags, or to the right of a second flag. If one does an about face, that will change the position of the flag.
also a sign of disrespect. when a color guard does a reverse the colors will take 2 right faces.
 

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Just keep telling yourself, "He has a right to his opinion. He has a right to his opinion. He has a right to his stupid &$%#ing opinion."
 

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RecoveringYankee said:
Just keep telling yourself, "He has a right to his opinion. He has a right to his opinion. He has a right to his stupid &$%#ing opinion."
All while gritting your teeth, biting your tongue, and restraining your fists from smashing his pathetic, ungrateful face.
 

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I don't think the flag is a symbol of freedom.
It's a symbol of America, her people (both those living today and those who came before), and the beliefs and values that those people hold dear. Freedom is only one of many values we claim to hold dear.

Now some people think the flag is a symbol of the federal government. Sure, they like to stick that flag on all their buildings and uniforms and vehicles and ID cards, but to me the flag is NOT just "the government." The government is not the people. The flag represents the people, the businesses, and our system of government.
 

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gruntpain1775 said:
GotUrBack said:
Quest50 said:
...Snip... Trivia: Why do you never perform an about face when carrying the flag?
Just a guess, but the flag, when carried in a parade or other procession should always be in the front in a line of several flags, or to the right of a second flag. If one does an about face, that will change the position of the flag.
also a sign of disrespect. when a color guard does a reverse the colors will take 2 right faces.
Left faces, and that only applies to the national colors. Everyone else is marching and doing column left/right's.

Also the colors in a 3-man color guard, and the center color in a 5-man color guard do execute an about face during a Colors Reverse command. However, it should be noted that those situations would not have the national colors (U.S. Flag) in those positions.

I was part of the color guard and drill team back in high school and went to competitions for both. As a result, I pretty much had to memorize the FM 22-5 (now FM 3-21).
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
ookoshi said:
gruntpain1775 said:
GotUrBack said:
Quest50 said:
...Snip... Trivia: Why do you never perform an about face when carrying the flag?
Just a guess, but the flag, when carried in a parade or other procession should always be in the front in a line of several flags, or to the right of a second flag. If one does an about face, that will change the position of the flag.
also a sign of disrespect. when a color guard does a reverse the colors will take 2 right faces.
Left faces, and that only applies to the national colors. Everyone else is marching and doing column left/right's.

Also the colors in a 3-man color guard, and the center color in a 5-man color guard do execute an about face during a Colors Reverse command. However, it should be noted that those situations would not have the national colors (U.S. Flag) in those positions.

I was part of the color guard and drill team back in high school and went to competitions for both. As a result, I pretty much had to memorize the FM 22-5 (now FM 3-21).
The answer is: Because the colors never retreat. (And of course because FM 3-21 says so)
 

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Devil's advocate here:

"The flag" represents the federal government. Why should I "worship" the flag?
 

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Quest50 said:
The answer is: Because the colors never retreat. (And of course because FM 3-21 says so)
Well, as a matter of practicality, the colors can only change to a rearward direction through a Colors Reverse or a Rear Wheel because the national colors have to be the rightmost colors in a color guard. If everyone just turned around, the U.S. Flag would be on the left side, which would be wrong.
 

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AV8R said:
GAGunOwner said:
Devil's advocate here:

"The flag" represents the federal government. Why should I "worship" the flag?
News to me, that the flag represents the government.
I don't think there was any doubt in the 1860s.
 

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gunsmoker said:
I don't think the flag is a symbol of freedom.
It's a symbol of America, her people (both those living today and those who came before), and the beliefs and values that those people hold dear. Freedom is only one of many values we claim to hold dear.

Now some people think the flag is a symbol of the federal government. Sure, they like to stick that flag on all their buildings and uniforms and vehicles and ID cards, but to me the flag is NOT just "the government." The government is not the people. The flag represents the people, the businesses, and our system of government.
That's correct, but I think the better argument might be that we live in a country who is gradually a little less and less free with every passing day.

I will say one caveat, though. Our gun rights have been greatly expanded in Georgia thanks to everyone in GeorgiaCarry.Org.

That guy sounds like he has had too much Obama Kool-Aid. I'm sure you can all remember Obama didn't put his hand across his heart or wear the flag as a lapel pen when he was a Senator or running for president. I noticed now that he is president, he does wear the lapel pen. :roll:

I call that unpatriotic. I know the U.S. has done some very disgraceful things in the past, but we have also done some great things. This country was also founded on freedom and anti-tyranny. Even though it has allowed awful things right here within our borders.
 

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GAGunOwner said:
Devil's advocate here:
"The flag" represents the federal government. Why should I "worship" the flag?
You don't worship the flag, you make a loyality oath to the republic it represents through the Pledge of Allegiance and since this country was found on freedom of dissent you can invoke the First Amendment which protects one's right to refrain from speaking or standing.

BTW, the "under God" part is more like saying "God willing" than implying the nation is actually "under" God.

1882
"I pledge allegiance to my flag and the republic for which it stands: one nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all."

1954
"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 

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...and another thing. By the time I got to HS hardly anyone recited the Pledge. When I was growing up in Canada in 1st through 6th grades we gathered in the gymnasium and sang "God Save the Queen" & "O Canada" EVERY morning (that'll wake you up). When I took french in 4th grade we had to be able to sing "O Canada" en francais by the end of term for the 3rd graders.
 

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don't know about any of you but my flag tht my dad bought me before he passed away has been flown every morning beofre I leave for work and taken down before I go to bed. Men and women gave their life for that flag and for everything that it represents. My father served and until the day he died he proudly flew it. so yes my father worshiped his flag, and that flag repaid him the exact same respect when he passed. We may have a corrupt government and a crappy president, but that will never change the fact that the flag represents alot of things to each and everyone of us, but the one thing that stands out across the world is Freedom. No one gave their life for it because of our government, they did it to protect the ground and the meaning in which it stood for and on.

Tell who ever told you that EJR that the next person he spills his opinions on may jack his jaw. If he doesn't believe in it, then get the @#[email protected]# off our land. Canada is accepting applications.
 

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You can't expect everyone you meet to have civility, patriotism, and common sense - sometimes you have to beat it into them....
 

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Owl said:
Why do we bother to pledge allegiance to the flag?
to me, its kinda like the guy who flips one cigarette upside down in every pack he buys because he thinks it will give him good luck, i have always found it to be a very idiosyncratic ritual....... i respect what the flag stands for, but in and of itself as a physical object, its just an avatar to me, in that it gives us a visual representation of the non physical.

i dont expect anyone here to understand the point im trying to convey here. and if any of get pissed or jump on me over this, then you clearly misunderstand what im saying.
 
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