Student Loses Free Speech (violent Story) case

Discussion in 'Off-topic' started by Malum Prohibitum, Aug 2, 2007.

  1. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    No link I can provide y'all, but the student who wrote the violent story has lost the appeal in the Eleventh Circuit, which cited the recent school shootings.
     
  2. Brian618

    Brian618 New Member

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    Sounds one step closer to the "Thought" Police
     

  3. legacy38

    legacy38 Active Member

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    So much for the rule of law.
     
  4. Brian618

    Brian618 New Member

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    Rule of Law has been just been given lip service over the last 20 to 30 years. Individual freedom continues to erode.
     
  5. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    That's a damn shame.
     
  6. viper32cm

    viper32cm New Member

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    :shakehead:

    I wonder who the judges were...

    Who can honestly says this is ok and keep a straight face.

    I want to read this opinion. I wonder if the Bong Hits for Jesus case had any bearing on the decision.
     
  7. viper32cm

    viper32cm New Member

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    This is rich:
     
  8. M249

    M249 New Member

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    If you truly care about your children, take them out of government schools. Continue to demand local, not federal, control of schools, and continue to fight for a voucher system.
     
  9. wsweeks2

    wsweeks2 New Member

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    + 1,000,000
     
  10. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Did any of you read what she wrote?
     
  11. Thorsen

    Thorsen New Member

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    I read it. I agree with the court on this one. I also think she got off easy by having her expulsion overturned by the school board.
     
  12. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    Close Case

    I read the disturbing story she wrote. I have no reason to think it was anything other than just an adolescent fantasy. Granted, there are a very small percentage of people who are twisted enough to carry out such a fantasy given the right circumstances, but this is rare. A lot more people think about doing bad things than actually do them.

    My beef with this decision, and the other one cited in the concurring opinion where some student got in trouble for creating a computer-generated image of somebody shooting a teacher, is that thinking or even talking about doing a bad thing is not a crime and cannot be penalized, unless the talking about it is done in a way that is threatening or disruptive.

    So, I think it would clearly be wrong to expel a student who writes in her own private diary, not intended for publication or distribution, "I hate my math teacher and dream about shooting him." That child may properly be subject to additional scrutiny, searches of her purse, locker, and book-bag, and that child may be referred to a counselor or therapist for an evaluation, but that kid should NOT be kicked out of school. That would be wrong, as she didn't DO anything bad, as contrasted with only thinking out loud about doing something bad.

    But on the other hand, it is clearly disruptive to a school to have students threaten teachers, and I'd say that "threat" would include the distribution of a written story about how the writer murders specific people at that school. The key here is distribution / publication. If this girl was passing her notebook around with the purpose of showing this sick and twisted story to other students, she was TRYING to cause a disturbance at the school. She was calling attention to herself and intended to make people think she was dangerous. It succeded. She got her wish. So now she has to live with the consequences.

    If she didn't want to be treated like a dangerous psycopath, she should not have portrayed herself as one under such conditions. She should have kept her inner demons to herself.

    (Ultimately, maybe it's good that she did this. This could have been a "cry for help" and now she's got such help, or intervention, or at least the attention that she craved.)
     
  13. wsweeks2

    wsweeks2 New Member

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    I was just agreeing with what M249 wrote about the public schools.
     
  14. viper32cm

    viper32cm New Member

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    Well for some reason before I read the opinion I thought this case was from one of the new stories after the VT shootings. Of course our federal court system doesn't work that quickly. I admit this is the first I've heard of this incident.

    As a general rule I hate the way public schools are run because all they seem to try to do is make the kids subservient and when that force is the government that makes me a little antsy. On the other hand, I realize that a lot of kids today are too stupid to understand libertarian principles (at least at that age). On the other hand again it's the school systems problem that they haven't given children enough education in civics and such to understand personal rights and responsibilities.

    The thing that irks me the most is that back when I was in High School 97-01. My friends and I wrote an adaptation of Lord of the Flies that included everyone in our high school lit class. As anyone who has read that book can attest too, a lot of the kids died. It wasn't malicious or anything, more along the lines of trying to demonstrate that perhaps being a preppy bitch wasn't the only thing in life. But under the holding of this case my school district could have done anything to us and gotten away with it. Since out of our group there have been two law students and one US Marine. Yeah, big threat there.

    I seriously doubt the holding of this case had been any different if the girl had "covered her tracks" by changing the name of the math teacher and changing key facts. The school district would have still found something to nail her on and they still would have gotten away with it.
     
  15. M249

    M249 New Member

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    I've read excerpts. The girl definitely deserved a dressing down from her folks for being stupid.

    I've dreamed about seriously harming some major public figures... that doesn't make me guilty of actually harming them. Are we prosecuting thought-crime now?