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Rather than the difficult Socratic method, which is going to be interrrupted and end up with questions and answers interspersed over several pages, I will paste a link to articles which you might find helpful on the subject.

Link

Link 2

 

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Link 3

 

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Prayer = Miracles. (Not all the time of course)

A Misguided Statement Regarding Miracles

A popular Christian teacher recently stated that sincere people, regardless of their religious affiliation, should not be discouraged from praying for miracles. In this week’s Penpoints, Wayne Jackson respectfully challenges this assertion.

 

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Does God Change?

 

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What is your definition of a miracle?

I will be the first one to say that GOD does perform miracles today just like HE did 2000 years ago. I have seen them in my own life. Would you place your hand on a red hot stove burner and expect not to get burned?

I would fully expect to get burned.

 

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What is your definition of a miracle?

If it was not answered sufficiently back on page 2, please let me know, and I will try again.

Malum,
I don't want to start another debate here, but could you explain this statement?

Miracles in the modern day? Sure. Let me ask you a question first. This is not biblically based, but merely your observation. Ever seen anybody raised form the dead? How about an ear instantaneously re-attached. Ever see any non-disputable miracle? The kind that everybody present would affirm was miraculous and nobody would deny?

The miracles Jesus did were of that sort. Even his enemies did not deny the miracles, but attributed them to Satan rather than God.

(1) Ever see any like that?

(2) What is the purpose of a miracle in the New Testament?

That first question is simple common sense, which, I assume you affirm God wants you to use.

The second question will begin to get us into the biblical portion of answering your question . . .

 

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You just can't stay away from these, can you?

 

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Well, if we're gonna start hijacking threads to talk about god I believe we are no longer abiding by the agreement.

Agreement? :shock: What agreement?
:sly:

 

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It was not an agreement so much as a decree by THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN, and you should note the exception to his decree and then note what forum is this thread . . .

Sounds like a deal to me.

I try to stay as hands off as possible but it is getting to be a bit too much (frankly I myself don't mind, but I do want to keep this website as a positive image, which does means toning it down a bit)

If anyone sees a topic wandering far off-topic (when not posted in the off-topic forum) or something that is vulgar, rude, or disrespectful (except when referring to anti-gunners ) please PM me, MP, or ICP. If it is one of us doing it, tell one of the others (I know I am guilty sending a post off-topic from time to time).

 

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Besides, Rammstein, are you really so hostile to the subject that you cannot stop yourself from complaining in a topic that has had nothing but religious discussion for two pages now (with the exception of your posts)?

Like you did not know that each time you came over here! :lol:

 

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please PM me, MP, or ICP. If it is one of us doing it, tell one of the others.

:wink:

I have had to censor myself previously because of input from one of the other two moderators.

And I follow GS1's behind the scenes instructions unhesitatingly, because this is his site, and frankly, he does not have to let me play here.

 

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Do you really not understand why this is annoying to me?

No, Rammstein, I do not, other than your personal hostility to religion in general and Christianity in particular. This does not really compare to the offense many people take at crude gutter remarks permeating the site - a problem that several people reported was causing avoidance of the forums and several others (including me) to stop recommending these forums to people.

I find it unlikely that anybody will refuse to visit the site or stop recommending it to people because there are religious articles linked in response to questions in one Off Topic thread - which to my knowledge is the only "religion" discussion since the site started cleaning up.

This thread started with brandishing snakes (a rather humorous news story). I then posted an article that I knew had a disturbing depiction of a man that appeared to be "brandishing" a snake. The picture turned out to be missing from the article, but I found the picture elsewhere and posted it directly here, to be seen on page one.

Yes, the article in the link had a religious theme.

Probably motivated by a cursory glance at the article, another poster mentioned something that was not accurate about what the bible has to say on the subject, and, when I corrected him, there were several questions posted.

I answered as honestly as I could.

Should I not do so?

Was there any "proselytizing" in the posts?

I answered many more questions privately in response to private messages.

Most of the religious matter was contained in articles I linked, and thus the discussion was not even present on this site which should thankfully spare you the grievous emotional distress you claim you suffer when you see anything religious. :roll:

I am not sure how you can compare this one thread to the gutter talk that had become so rampant on this site that it was about to force the moderators, against their unanimous inclinations, to take a stronger editorial hand.

So you go and find the one thread that even mentions or links to something religious (and in the Off Topic section at that) and post every third post or so about how offended you are.

And you expect us to take that seriously?

Rammstein, to be perfectly honest, I would actually agree with you if religious proselytizing was present in "every other thread," as you state, but it is not. You found one thread after the MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN weighed in on the trash talk.

I frankly do not take anything you have posted in this thread seriously, and I suspect you do not, either.

If you really do take your posts in this thread seriously, then I have to question why you keep returning to the thread. This does not strike me as rational.

If there was a thread, two thirds of which was devoted to the crudest and vilest sort of perversions, or links to sites containing the same, I cannot say I would keep returning to it (except as appropriate in a moderator role).

As a more pedestrian example, I do not have a great interest in knives. Guess which thread near this one I have not been reading? Maybe I should go over there and post every third post about how boring a thread on knives is and demand that they "understand" my boredom and annoyance.

 

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:shock:

 

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The whole idea of a word being "bad" is ridiculous.

Report back when you have kids.

 

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If however in one of those topics someone says that everyone in . . . Religion X is a liar, thief and crook... well that is a different matter entirely.

Even muslims?

 

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Re:

<snip>

I'm not trying to make this into a big thing, but it all basically boils down to if I see something I don't like I should not go in the thread but if others see something they don't like then we should stop people from talking in that manner.

I guess have not been clear enough...

The restrictions are not on what someone does not like or disagrees with, it is what people find offensive. Many people find curse words and lude comments offensive.

If you do find a post truely offensive and not just disliked or disapproved of then PM a moderator, if it was a moderator who posted it, send the PM to a different Mod. DO NOT COMMENT IN THE OFFENISIVE TOPIC!

If you truely are offended by the mention of any religion or religious topic, well sorry but there will be occasional topics regarding that. It can't be helped. If however in one of those topics someone says that everyone in or not a member of Religion X is a liar, thief and crook... well that is a different matter entirely.

I will try to accomodate as much as possible, but there is a limit. Merely disliking or disapproving of a topic or post is not enough.