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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
... never mind


It is not known whether Verizon is the only cell-phone provider to be targeted with such an order, although previous reporting has suggested the NSA has collected cell records from all major mobile networks.

 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
A senior law enforcement official pushed back on the report early Thursday morning, telling Fox News that the Justice Department has not yet received a referral from the intelligence community, meaning "the process has not started yet."

But the administration has not denied the existence of the order. While the administration defended its authority to seize phone records -- and stressed that it does not monitor calls -- one civil liberties group called this the "broadest surveillance order to ever have been issued."

The official also said that any court orders issued under FISA are subject to "strict controls" to ensure the rights of citizens are not violated.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06 ... port-says/
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Sen. Graham: ‘I’m a Verizon customer. I don’t mind turning over records’
“I don’t mind Verizon turning over records to the government if the government’s going to make sure that they try to match up a known terrorist phone with somebody in the United States. I don’t think you’re talking to terrorists. I know you’re not. I know I’m not. So, we don’t have anything to worry about.â€
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/06/06/s ... r-records/

 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Blindeye_03 said:
You realize [s:1l1oo1ab]its[/s:1l1oo1ab] it is not Verizon to blame and [s:1l1oo1ab]its[/s:1l1oo1ab] it is the goverment, right?
:wink:

 

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I use T-Mobile, they are welcome to have my phone records.

Going to make for some very boring monitoring sessions though. :(
 

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Billennium said:

That's a good one. According to Senators this has been going on for years. They knew and it is nothing new. The liberal media is pointing out that that this was done under the Patriot Act, which we can thank the Bush Administration for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

NSA reportedly collecting phone records of millions, though officials had denied holding 'data' on Americans

Reports that the Obama administration has been collecting the phone records of millions of Verizon customers in the U.S. could contradict statements made by top officials who previously claimed the government was not holding data on Americans.

Director of National Intelligence James Clapper was asked at a March hearing whether the National Security Agency collects any data on millions of Americans.

"No sir ... not wittingly," Clapper responded, acknowledging there are cases "where inadvertently, perhaps" the data could be collected.

NSA Director Gen. Keith Alexander also told Fox News last year that the agency does not "hold data on U.S. citizens."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06 ... z2VSU9qPSj

Senate intelligence leaders say phone surveillance is 'lawful'
The top Democrat and Republican on the Senate Select Committee On Intelligence said Thursday the government's top-secret court order to obtain phone records on millions of Americans was "lawful" and Congress had been briefed on the issue.

"As far as I know this is the exact three month renewal of what has been the case for the past seven years. This renewal is carried out by the [Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act] court under the business records section of the Patriot Act," Sen. Dianne Feinstein, who chairs the intelligence committee, told reporters in the Senate gallery. "Therefore it is lawful. It has been briefed to Congress."
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... ?hpt=hp_t2

 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
RedDawnTheMusical said:
The liberal media is pointing out that that this was done under the Patriot Act, which we can thank the Bush Administration for.
By the way, GW has no excuses but....

"This administration also puts forward a false choice between the liberties we cherish and the security we provide. I will provide our intelligence and law enforcement agencies with the tools they need to track and take out the terrorists without undermining our Constitution and our freedom. That means no more illegal wiretapping of American citizens. No more national security letters to spy on citizens who are not suspected of a crime. No more tracking citizens who do nothing more than protest a misguided war. No more ignoring the law when it is inconvenient."
Sen. Barack Obama - 2007
 

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Billennium said:
RedDawnTheMusical said:
The liberal media is pointing out that that this was done under the Patriot Act, which we can thank the Bush Administration for.
By the way, GW has no excuses but....

"No more national security letters to spy on citizens who are not suspected of a crime. No more tracking citizens who do nothing more than protest a misguided war. No more ignoring the law when it is inconvenient. That is not who we are. And it is not what is necessary to defeat the terrorists. The FISA court works. The separation of powers works. Our Constitution works. We will again set an example for the world that the law is not subject to the whims of stubborn rulers, and that justice is not arbitrary."
Sen. Barack Obama - 2007
And that is exactly it. Yes, GW gave us the Patriot Act which many, including conservatives, took issue with. It, however, took effect as a "necessary evil" during the war on terror and was supposed to be temporary. Obama campaigned on repealing it and the transparency of government. Instead, it was extended on his watch and, it appears that government is just as corrupt now as ever (if not more) and everyone is doing everything they can to hide it. To top it all of though, much of the media still tries to ignore all of this or, of course, blame it on GW.

Here is the issue with this story: This warrant covered the phone records (phone numbers, originator's number, and call duration, date, etc.) for every phone on Verizon's network (and likely others). It is unbelievably overly-broad. It is the government demanding complete records from a private service provider. If the government was entitled to this information on a whim, then they should eliminate private communication networks and have all services provided by government agencies. That isn't what this country is about and, typically, warrants have a burden of proof that has to be met. I know that the secretive federal court that issued this warrant(s) is more lenient, but all records for all users?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
RedDawnTheMusical said:
Here is the issue with this story: .................
That it is so big that if nothing happens this time we are done.
 

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Billennium said:
RedDawnTheMusical said:
Here is the issue with this story: .................
That it is so big that if nothing happens this time we are done.
"As far as I know, this is the exact three-month renewal of what has been the case for the past seven years," said Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-California. "This renewal is carried out by the FISA court under the business records section of the Patriot Act. Therefore it is lawful. It has been briefed to Congress."
So there you have it - all phone records for the last seven years being parsed by NSA computers (explains why the NSA built that large new data center that they refused to state the function what data would be processed there), apparently looking for patterns and matching records against other intelligence gathered, which supposedly resulted in the prevention of one potential terrorist attack (no details provided). And that doesn't seem to bother any of the Senators as the blatant invasion of personal privacy is justified by the greater good of the society. How scary is that? Today is intelligence gathering for the war on terror. Why not extend it to the war on drugs? The war on crime? The war on guns? etc. etc. Where does it stop? There is a reason that there is burden on law enforcement to present reasonable suspicions of a particular crime involving particular people when seeking a warrant - they are not supposed to be a tool to temporarily suspend someone's rights for a fishing expedition that they might be doing something illegal. And this has been going on for seven years?
 

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Billennium said:
I never thought I would find myself agreeing with Hank Johnson or John Lewis.
 

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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-act-says-phone-records-collection-excessive/
Author of Patriot Act says NSA phone records collection 'never the intent' of law. Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., who wrote the 2001 law, was among a host of lawmakers on both sides of the aisle who raised alarm over the practice. "This is a big deal, a really big deal," Sensenbrenner told Fox News, adding that such a broad seizure was "never the intent" of the law. He floated the possibility of amending the Patriot Act before its 2015 expiration to stop this.
 

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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...says-administration-has-lost-all-credibility/
The New York Times editorial board, which twice endorsed President Obama and has championed many planks of his agenda, on Thursday turned on the president over the government's mass collection of phone data -- saying the administration has 'lost all credibility.'
[The NY Times] said the administration was using the "same platitude" it uses in every case of overreach -- that "terrorists are a real menace and you should just trust us."
 
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