Shot at Cops in Self Defense?

Discussion in 'In the News' started by Malum Prohibitum, Sep 15, 2007.

  1. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Judge is issuing self defense instruction to jury.

     
  2. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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  3. ptsmith24

    ptsmith24 New Member

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    That first link doesn't link to the correct story...

    This one does as of 1727.
     
  4. Axeman

    Axeman New Member

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    :popcorn:

    I sometimes think about this very situation. With all those No knock warrents, and cops busting down the wrong doors.

    I am surprised the guy survived to go to trial.
     
  5. CoolHand

    CoolHand Active Member

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    So let me get this straight. Some anonymous snitch that's probably a druggy criminal of scrupulous moral character themselves "gives" the police a tip out of the kindness of their heart expecting no financial or other benefit, that this guy wants a detective dead.

    What do the cops do? Pick the dude up at work? Nope. Catch him outside his home on a minor traffic violation in broad daylight? Nah... that'd make to much sense. Oh! Oh! I know let's send the SWAT team ninjas with REAL fully automatic assault weapons to his house at 4am blow the door, toss in a couple of flash bang GRENADES, trash the place, and yank him and his elderly momma out of bed in their undies. Yup that's the safest, most professional, and least disruptive way to do it.

    The only reason I can see sending in the swat team on this guy is if he had a history(i.e. violent criminal record). I'd like to know more background info about this case. If the guy is truly an innocent victim more power to him. I still think he'll get screwed either way though.
     
  6. Firearmz

    Firearmz New Member

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  7. ptsmith24

    ptsmith24 New Member

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    If they did that, they couldn't justify their existence.
     
  8. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Did you see that the grand jury did not return an indictment on the charges that prompted the SWAT entry? They indicted him only for the two counts related to shooting at the SWAT team.

     
  9. murrybird

    murrybird New Member

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    This is why I am very much agianst the use of these "no-knock" warrents and the use of SWAT teams. Who are blurring the lines of law enforcement and the military. It was this sort of behavior which created the Posse Comitatus Act in the first place. We have police units useing M113 tracked vehicles, trained in military tactics, and dress out like an Army Ranger.

    Judges also need to question and become more hestitant on the issuing of no-knocks, instead of issuing them out like candy. Actually investigate the person in question, because sometimes LEOs either don't have good intel or embelish the "probable cause" for the warrent.

    Yes, sometimes a no-knock is needed for dangerous persons and the safety of the officers.Same goes for the use of SWAT teams. They shouldn't be used to validate their existence. But, used as the expection, not the rule for law enforcment. But, what do I know, to most law enforcment types I am just a "civilian".
     
  10. Mobster989

    Mobster989 New Member

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    http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=6476

    That's a link to an interesting read about SWAT and how even little podunk towns with less than 5,000 people have SWAT teams and how more and more they are being used to execute simple arrest warrants on non-violent offenders based on the word of paid informants.
     
  11. Firearmz

    Firearmz New Member

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    I don't think there is anything wrong with SWAT Teams and their use, the problem is the restraints in using them. Everything has a place finding judges and chief law enforcement officers that can appropriately deploy them.
     
  12. AV8R

    AV8R Banned

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    Careful PT, your genius is showing.
     
  13. Thorsen

    Thorsen New Member

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    Just like the government could have arrested David Koresh while he was eating at his favorite restaurant in town. A restaurant he ate in every week on the same day of the week. But then they wouldn't have gotten to use all their fancy toys and neato equipment.
     
  14. Mobster989

    Mobster989 New Member

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    Exactly the point of the CATO article. The problem is that when these small towns get SWAT teams they are cheap to start up because the government gives them huge discounts on military surplus weapons and gear, then after the first two or three years they start eating into the budget of the small town's police force. It gets better though because they get federal funds based on how many drugs they confiscate. So they start using the SWAT teams more and more to carry out simplier warrants and arrests. That link has numerous examples of raids (carried out by SWAT) that were against non-violent criminals and or innocent civilians. Many of those raids could have been performed by uniformed officers during daylight hours.
     
  15. ptsmith24

    ptsmith24 New Member

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    :oops:
     
  16. CoolHand

    CoolHand Active Member

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    I was being sarcastic. I should have added that the snitch was so not credible that the grand jury no billed that charge.
     
  17. GA_Boy

    GA_Boy Guest

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    I have noticed more and more that SWAT teams have been used for more than they should. Yes I am military and there is alot that we see and try to figure out.

    We look at things and see that in the news there is SWAT doing this and that and we ask should or could the regular cops do this or that.

    I can tell you if someone come running in my house at oh dark thirty and I dont know who or what it is they will be greeted by a hell of alot of firepower from my end.

    If you ask me the SWAT team got what they deserved when the guy shot at them. I have never liked the " NO KNOCK " warrent and it seemd like judges do give them out like candy. Cops also make the thing up to be soo big that they have to do this and they really dont.

    Yes I do see a need for " NO KNOCK " warrents for the really bad guys. I would also recommend the use of SWAT for these guys.
     
  18. kkennett

    kkennett New Member

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    Mr. Urquiza has been convicted of shooting at one officer and acquitted of shooting at another. That's an odd results. There must be some more to this story that we don't know. He was sentenced to the minimum 5 years.

    http://www.courier-gazette.com/articles ... ews/69.txt
     
  19. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    It certainly has its place. It is just over-used.
     
  20. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Wow, that is odd. The educated reporter seems to think that the jury sentenced him as well as finding him guilty.