Question on Open Carry and 16-11-128

Discussion in 'GA Laws and Politics' started by oxfat, Jul 22, 2007.

  1. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    In 16-11-128 the wording:

    Carrying pistol without license

    (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner.

    Does the "provided further" statement belong to the first section or is it an extension of the "provided" statement on hunting, or both?

    I've read posts that say 16-11-128 by inference refers to OC, because 16-11-126 is for CCW. That would make me believe that the "provided further" refers only to the "provided" section.
     
  2. GAGunOwner

    GAGunOwner Active Member

    It means that you can open carry without a GFL if you are legally hunting/fishing/sport shooting and you have permission of the owner of the land.
     

  3. GAGunOwner

    GAGunOwner Active Member

    I hope I'm understanding your question?
     
  4. Thorsen

    Thorsen New Member

    4,226
    0
    0
    You know that is a bad grammatical phrasing there. I know the intent of the phrase is to say that you do not need a GFL if you have a hunting license and are engaged in legal hunting, but by not bracketing the preposition for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses with commas the legislature included the who are engaged ... portion of the statute in the for persons not required... portion of the statute and grammatically excluded it from the portion I highlighted in bold text. I doubt the argument would fly in a court of law that you didn't need a GFL to openly carry because you had a hunting license on your person, but as the statute is written that is what it is grammatically saying.
     
  5. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    GAGunOwner,

    The intent of my question is that if the "provided further" clause only refers to the "provided" clause, then it seems to me that open carry is more inferred than directly stated. If the "provided further" clause relates to the first statement, then open carry is, in my understanding, much more directly supported.

    I'd like to open carry on occasion, so I want to understand this section.

    Thanks!
     
  6. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    Thorsen,

    I am not as interested in grammatical phrasing as I am in the generally accepted interpretation of this section.

    I have a GFL, so it is not a matter of trying to circumvent the requirement to have a license.
     
  7. Thorsen

    Thorsen New Member

    4,226
    0
    0
    Oh, I didn't intend to suggest you were. I just found it interesting that the statute was poorly written in the first place.
     
  8. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    Hmnn . . . I responded last night. This morning I don't see it. I must be working too hard. Anyway-


    I agree 100% with you on that, Thorsen. If I wrote training materials like this I'd lose my job.
     
  9. Wiley

    Wiley New Member

    2,609
    0
    0
    I think that the word 'and' could be substituted for 'provided, further' with no loss of meaning and an increase in clarity.
     
  10. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    Wiley,

    In that case I would say that it refers to the "provided" clause.

    In the "Laws in Plain English" section for 16-11-128 it states that you can open carry with a license.

    So I'm thinking I'll try it out.
     
  11. Adam5

    Adam5 Atlanta Overwatch

    13,288
    60
    48
    I would OC more often, but I get get tired of my wife "reminding me" that my pistol is showing. :roll:
     
  12. Gunstar1

    Gunstar1 Administrator

    8,460
    5
    38
    Check your zipper every time she does it. :mrgreen:
     
  13. fallison

    fallison New Member

    895
    0
    0
    :rotfl2:
     
  14. Adam5

    Adam5 Atlanta Overwatch

    13,288
    60
    48
    :rotfl2:
     
  15. wsweeks2

    wsweeks2 New Member

    6,306
    0
    0
    My fiancee and I had a pretty big fight last night about me OCing. She said she doesn't like it, so I told her in all sincerity that she didn't have to OC if she doesn't want to. She's asking me not to which I have a problem with.

    Like I told her - I am not in any way telling her what to carry on or about her person and that what I chose to do was up to me as long as it was legal. She started with the whole "it makes other people uncomfortable" line to which I asked "how is that my problem?" If people are afraid of something inanimate, they should seek help.

    She said I wasn't respecting her feelings, however I told her that she wasn't respecting mine as this issue is something I feel strongly about and I use OCing as a way to educate and raise awareness. I have yet to have someone freak out at the sight of my menacing tupperware gun.
     
  16. oxfat

    oxfat New Member

    726
    0
    0
    I'm sorry to hear that. Fights with your fiance/wife/girlfriend are never good. However, it prompted me to have "the talk" with my wife. That is, "Honey, how would you feel if I were to open carry?" At first she thought it would be odd, and worried that someone would call 911 or something. As we talked however we ended up agreeing that to OC it would be best if I OC'd when I was "professionally dressed." Looking like a hoodlum or gangster while OC'ing would not provide people with a reassuring impression of OC'ers.

    So, I think overall it was a good thing that we talked about it first.

    Thanks for the prompt, and best of luck to you, wsweeks2. I hope it all gets ironed out.
     
  17. AV8R

    AV8R Banned

    6,624
    0
    0
    That's a pickle. Is it that she feels awkward when you OC? Maybe it is awkward for her to see people obviously uncomfortable at the sight of your firearm?
     
  18. wsweeks2

    wsweeks2 New Member

    6,306
    0
    0
    She's paranoid that someone's going to call the cops and that they're going to send out the SWAT team and I'll end up in jail for the next 150 years.

    Also she says it's not respectful of others feelings. I'm one of the ones who honestly doesn't care about people whose feelings get hurt that easily.
     
  19. GAGunOwner

    GAGunOwner Active Member

    She has a point to some extent but so do you.

    If it makes her feel uncomfortable, I think its only because she cares for you and she doesn't want you to get hurt or end up in jail. Many people also do not like attention it brings.

    Consider a compromise with her. Tell her that you will open carry when you are alone and that you reserve the right to occasionally open carry with her when you are dressed more nicely. Tell her that you are willing to not open carry if you guys go out to a movie together or if you go shopping together, etc. I'm just throwing that out there.

    Anyway...

    I still live with familiy and they strongly discouraged me from open carrying (one of these family members is a retired LEO). I still live under their roof and they would be the ones who would have to bail me out of jail. I told them that I wouldn't open carry very much, anytime soon. Call me a wimp if you'd like. They were just fearful that I'd run across a cop that didn't know that law and that I'd end up in jail.

    This isn't to scare anyone but if you open carry long enough you will eventually have a police encounter and they can go bad quickly, that's all I'm saying. You probably won't go to jail (though you very well could) but you'll have to explain yourself (sad I know).

    I'm 100% pro-open carry and commend anyone who does it but with my job and future plans I absolutely cannot go to jail, especially on a gun charge. In most situations, GA's laws just aren't ripe enough yet for me to feel comfortable open carrying.