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Any updates to this over the last couple of years regarding metal detectors, screening, etc.? For this year their website states these things:

Inspectionâ€" Be prepared for inspection as you enter the festival. This inspection will include the use of metal detectors. Permitted bags will be searched and may slow down your entry time.
The following items are PROHIBITED:.... Weapons or explosives of any kind
Every attendee (including media) will be searched prior to entry. By purchasing a ticket, you agree to submit to a thorough, TSA-style search, including emptying your pockets and bags, a full pat-down, having all of your items examined, and possibly removing your shoes. Police officers work both inside and outside our events. All narcotics laws are strictly enforced. We reserve the right to refuse entry to anyone.
 

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Looks like they have been emboldened by GCO's trial court loss in the Botanical Gardens case.
 

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Discussion Starter · #63 ·
I just now sent this email to the city attorney:

Dear City Attorney Robinson,

At the website, https://www.musicmidtown.com/information/, for the upcoming music festival in Piedmont Park this September, is the following statement:

"Every attendee (including media) will be searched prior to entry. By purchasing a ticket, you agree to submit to a thorough, TSA-style search, including emptying your pockets and bags, a full pat-down, having all of your items examined, and possibly removing your shoes."

I'm writing to ask if the city will tolerate TSA-Style searches and pat-downs of citizens attending a public event at a public city park. I imagine there might be some who could quickly react with a measure of physical violence if private, non-government security personnel were to touch or even come close to touching anyone's private areas on their body. I would completely understand such a reaction.

In addition,their website has a statement prohibiting "weapons of any kind". As you know Georgia has state preemption with regard to the carrying of weapons, and Piedmont Park is NOT privately owned property. I'd like your assurance that Atlanta Police will follow state law in this matter with legally carried weapons in the park during the festival, whether those firearms are carried openly or concealed by those who possess a valid weapons license.

I urge you to revoke the organizer's permit to hold the festival if they do not revise their policy in a timely fashion, both on the website and in practice, to reflect State of Georgia weapons preemption and U.S. Constitutional 4th Amendment Law.

Thank you and best regards,

Phillip Evans
 

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Discussion Starter · #65 ·
Naturally, I never received a response from my email. They just want to ignore the issue and hope no one presses it with open carry. I have a feeling APD would not arrest you, but they might give you a hard time about it.
 

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Naturally, I never received a response from my email. They just want to ignore the issue and hope no one presses it with open carry. I have a feeling APD would not arrest you, but they might give you a hard time about it.
If the organizer refuses to let you in, then what?
 

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Discussion Starter · #68 ·
Deep concealment to get in.

However, I would not suggest to push it with open carry at this time. Hopefully the Atlanta Botanical case will resolve this in our favor soon.

If the organizer refuses to let you in, then what?
 

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Is my understanding of our current situation incorrect?

If its private property all they can do is ask you to leave.

If its public property pay can't ask you to leave.

Assuming you don't refuse to leave, I can't see any situation where this results in a lawful arrest.
 

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An unlawful arrest is especially annoying to the arrested person. But he can sue and win $1.00
 

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Assuming you don't refuse to leave, I can't see any situation where this results in a lawful arrest.
Have you ever been to jail in the City of Atlanta? Stayed overnight?

And what if you get arrested and the Botanical Gardens case results in an affirmance of the trial court ruling from Fulton County? Then will the arrest be "unlawful?" We are assuming a lot here. I would not want to jump the gun. I would not count our chickens before they hatch. I would not get the cart before the horse.
 

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And what if you get arrested and the Botanical Gardens case results in an affirmance of the trial court ruling from Fulton County? Then will the arrest be "unlawful?" We are assuming a lot here.
I am not assuming anything, I am asking.

For the sake of discussion, Let's assume the case goes badly. The gardens, and music midtown, are now indisputably treated as private. What is unlawful about being armed that gives probable cause for lawful arrest?

An unlawful arrest is especially annoying to the arrested person. But he can sue and win $1.00
There are members here who would dispute that figure.
 

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after legal fees ? I would not chance it the way my luck has been with cops and judges.
 

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arrest

I am not assuming anything, I am asking.

For the sake of discussion, Let's assume the case goes badly. The gardens, and music midtown, are now indisputably treated as private. What is unlawful about being armed that gives probable cause for lawful arrest?
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If you enter after being told you can't come into the Park and attend the festival, the charge would be "criminal trespassing."
Ditto for you already being there, but they notice the gun and then tell you to leave. Criminal trespass. It applies to public property and public facilities too, without doubt (except for gun restrictions, which IS in doubt until the Court of Appeals rules).

Now suppose you don't enter, but you stand there at the edge of the festival perimeter and argue and complain.

Disorderly conduct?

If a cop tells you to move along and stop causing a disturbance that is distracting him from his other duties, and you still shoot your mouth off, and the cop doesn't feel he can walk away and trust you not to try to re-enter the festival or harass the festival security staff...

... can the cop arrest you for obstruction? Interference with the lawful duties of an officer?

There are a lot of criminal charges that boil down to "contempt of cop." They're flexible and with vague standards, but the courts let prosecutions under these laws proceed because, well, most cops know when to use them and the people they use them against are abrasive, disagreeable people that the judge and jury will take an instant dislike to.
 

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Why do you want to bring more resources in on the opposing side? Right now we have a near-ideal test case with an opponent that is very resource-constrained and only marginally interested in the case. Do you want EVERY entity that leases property from any state or local government to weigh in on the case? I would rather let this slide under the radar and let the botanical gardens case run its course. Win and we have an ironclad precedent. Lose and the legislature takes another run at fixing it. Get the wrong attention such as NFL, MLB, Ticketmaster, etc. that have marketing and lobbying budgets several orders of magnitude above that of GCO and we lose permanently in the courts AND the legislature. Think about the goal, not about the fight.
 

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Why do you want to bring more resources in on the opposing side? Right now we have a near-ideal test case with an opponent that is very resource-constrained and only marginally interested in the case. Do you want EVERY entity that leases property from any state or local government to weigh in on the case? I would rather let this slide under the radar and let the botanical gardens case run its course. Win and we have an ironclad precedent. Lose and the legislature takes another run at fixing it. Get the wrong attention such as NFL, MLB, Ticketmaster, etc. that have marketing and lobbying budgets several orders of magnitude above that of GCO and we lose permanently in the courts AND the legislature. Think about the goal, not about the fight.
Excellent point. That makes perfect sense to me.

Somewhat similar to one of the reasons why I don't normally open carry when in public in town. Just because I can do something doesn't mean I necessarily want to do it. Until it comes time, I am not one to flaunt anything in anyone's face. Or keep pushing until I force someone's hand in pushing back. As they say, discretion is the better part of valor. And...pick your battles. However, when it comes time to fight, real hard, then fight real hard.
 

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Somewhat similar to one of the reasons why I don't normally open carry when in public in town. Just because I can do something doesn't mean I necessarily want to do it. Until it comes time, I am not one to flaunt anything in anyone's face.
There's a reason why the statutes don't use the term "open flaunting."
 

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Now suppose you don't enter, but you stand there at the edge of the festival perimeter and argue and complain.
Disorderly conduct?
Has that person done any of the following:

(1) Acts in a violent or tumultuous manner toward another person whereby such person is placed in reasonable fear of the safety of such person's life, limb, or health;

(2) Acts in a violent or tumultuous manner toward another person whereby the property of such person is placed in danger of being damaged or destroyed;

(3) Without provocation, uses to or of another person in such other person's presence, opprobrious or abusive words which by their very utterance tend to incite to an immediate breach of the peace, that is to say, words which as a matter of common knowledge and under ordinary circumstances will, when used to or of another person in such other person's presence, naturally tend to provoke violent resentment, that is, words commonly called "fighting words"; or

(4) Without provocation, uses obscene and vulgar or profane language in the presence of or by telephone to a person under the age of 14 years which threatens an immediate breach of the peace.

If not, then they have not committed the crime of disorderly conduct.

If a cop tells you to move along and stop causing a disturbance that is distracting him from his other duties, and you still shoot your mouth off, and the cop doesn't feel he can walk away and trust you not to try to re-enter the festival or harass the festival security staff...

... can the cop arrest you for obstruction? Interference with the lawful duties of an officer?
I cannot find where interference appears in OCGA. Obstruction is covered in 16-3-24(a). Is acting as hired security at a private event one of their official duties?

Furthermore, If I am outside the event on public land and engaged in absolutely no unlawful activity can they legally order me to leave? Especially considering that the reason for my continued presence outside is the possession of a firearm, which the city is expressly prohibited form asking me to leave the park for?

I think this does not differ much at all from the Pirkle Park case, and a person with the inclination and the resources stands a very good chance of winning.

Why do you want to bring more resources in on the opposing side? Right now we have a near-ideal test case with an opponent that is very resource-constrained and only marginally interested in the case.
There are two issues on the table here. The legal analysis, which I am engaged in here, and the GCO strategy which I support 100%

Do you want EVERY entity that leases property from any state or local government to weigh in on the case? I would rather let this slide under the radar and let the botanical gardens case run its course. Win and we have an ironclad precedent. Lose and the legislature takes another run at fixing it. Get the wrong attention such as NFL, MLB, Ticketmaster, etc. that have marketing and lobbying budgets several orders of magnitude above that of GCO and we lose permanently in the courts AND the legislature. Think about the goal, not about the fight.
I think what you described is the inevitable course of action, victory or not. What is happening at the Stadium, Dome, Philip's Arena, etc is a flagrant end -run of the law. Everyone involved knows they are thumbing their nose at pre-emption. When ABG sets precedent, I fully expect the corporate big boys to throw money at Deal and co. And the republicans in the legislature will bend over backwards to pass a bill to please them.
 
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