i always carry with one in the pipe but i cannot carry at work so i unload when i stow the gun in my trunk at work. what are some suggestions to deal with bullet set-back after reloading it? i already cycle them thru the magazine and fire them on my next trip to the range... but that is not as often as it used to be and set-back is becoming visually apparent to me lately.... just something to ask
and where do you draw the limit on when to just discard the round?
I saw a post on Glock Talk about this one day. Several people on the site had a methid that made sense to me, and I'm considering starting to use. Everytime they unchamber a round, they use a Sharpie to put a line around the case and put it in the bottom of the mag ( I know, you have to take all the other rounds out to do it). After all the round in a mag have 5 stripes, they shoot the rounds and reload the mag. The concensus is that any cartridge should be able to withstand being chambered 5 times.
Adam5, I respectfully disagree with that method. I think that is just a little too extreme about bullet set back.
But, to be fair, tomorrow I will take one of my carry cartridges (that has never been chambered) and do a test. I'll measure it before and after chambering in increments of five. I won't be easing the round in either, I'll just push down the slide stop and let the slide fly forward.
My guess is that there won't be any real change in setback until about 25 times.
I agree that 5 is being way on the cautious side. The way I see it, I'll brobably practice with my carry ammo before I getting 5 stripes on each round anyway, esp with the 17 round mag in my Glock. I try to practice with a box of my carry ammo every month and a half or so anyway. I don't want to get too used to the feel of 115 FMJ in my G17, then have my life depend on accurate/fast follow up shots with 147 JHP. The same goes for 95 FMJ for practice in .380, and 102 JHP for carry use.
here is a pic of what i am talking about.... the first in a new 124gr JHP, the second is the same round after about 5 chamberings... the third is a 124 gr golden sabre round after about 25 chamberings
i tried to get the pic to show up on the post but i couldn't ....
i agree with you on letting the third one go.....that is where i was going with the where do you draw the line to discard the round? how much is allowable?
I used a Winchester White Box Hollow Point cartridge and a Glock 19. Released slide by way of slide stop.
Here are the results:
WWB 9mm Bullet Set Back Test Normal - 2.8cm After 5 - 2.8cm After 10 - 2.8cm After 15 - 2.8cm After 20 - 2.8cm After 25 - 2.8cm Note: visible movement of lead towards front of bullet. After 30 - 2.8cm After 35 - 2.8cm After 40 - 2.8cm Note: lead actually coming out of top of hollow point. After 45 - 2.8cm Note: copper tip completely deformed. After 50 - 2.8cm
Conclusions:
The bullet never actually sank into the casing. Around 25 times the lead started to creep towards the opening of the bullet. By the 45th chambering the copper tip was deformed, being pushed inward and making the circle smaller.
Chambering a bullet upwards of twenty times may affect integrity of the bullet with possible adverse affect to bullet expansion.
My personal observations: I would be confident that I would shoot the round in normal training well before the bullet may become compromised.
Me personally? At the first visible sign of setback I'd probably toss it. Now I don't mean getting out the ruler and measuring it, but if you eyeball it and it looks off then toss it. Bullet setback will change the pressure and while Glocks are rates for +P and +P+ ammo, I still would not take the chance.
The thing that I noticed in my test was that it wasn't so much bullet setback into the casing, rather the deformation of the bullet. If it is chambered enough times to change the opening of the hollow point then it may affect the way the round expands. And since expansion and penetration is the name of the game I wouldn't want to chance using a deformed round.
I have not tested deformed rounds so I can not say with any certainty that it would change expansion. It is my opinion that it does though.
That is interesting. I normally briefly inspect all round that I load. Not in depth, but just look to make sure looks right. Any signs of damage ad it gets tossed.
Speaking of bad rounds, I had my first bad WWB yesterday. In the middle of one of the mags I ran throught my 17 all I get was a click. I racked the slide to clear it and kept on shooting. After the mag was empty I picked the one that just clicked up off floor and looked at it. You could see where the striker hit dead center of the primer. I loaded that round again and all I got was a click. My Glock ran perfect through about 75 rounds or so (as usual) except for that one round. Just to be sure that it was the round I loaded it into my Hi Point Carbine and got the same result.
Next time I get to the range I am going to cook off my remaining WWB HP rounds. I am going to switch to all Federal HST rounds.
I've read a lot of stuff about them and they have some of the best expansion I have seen. Not to mention it was more prone to keep it's jacket then Ranger Ts.
I've been keeping Remington Golden Sabers in the PPK. 955 fps and 200 ft-lbs isn't bad for a 380. I use Hornady TAP-FPD in my glock. 975 fps and 310 ft-lbs.
BTW: Have you seen the specs on Federal's 9mm 105gr EFMJ? 1230 fps and 353 ft-lbs is pretty good for 9mm. The expanding full metal jacket is an interesting concept.
have either of you tried hornaday 115gr XTP in 9mm? a friend of mine just gave me 50 of them to try out he is trying to get me to change. (from 124gr golden sabres)
I have Hornady TAP in my Glock 23, but when those get shot out it will e Federal HST. No other round that I have seen gets the kind of consistent expansion like HST.
i tried to get the pic to show up on the post but i couldn't ....
i agree with you on letting the third one go.....that is where i was going with the where do you draw the line to discard the round? how much is allowable?
I'm not sure about your Hi-Point 380, but I've found that Remington Golden Saber 105gr work great in my Walther PPK/S. They also give it a nice little punch for a .380.
Thanks, these are my first own guns and I dont really know to much about ammo but what I read about it and I dont really know what I'm looking for in the quality.
I'm have been shooting with other people weapons. Now I have my very own, Glock 23C and Hi- Point CF 380. I would like to know what to look for in ammo. My beat friend work for APD and he gave me the info on the ammo I use now.
Another question, is cheaper price means cheap ammo; high dollar price ammo work the best???? :?:
Of course not. Just because you have a Sean John coat with a 300$ price tag, will it keep you warmer than a 20$ fleece? Probably not.
.380's are borderline anemic. Hornady 90-gr. HP/XTP seem to be popular. Federals are always good. Gold Dots seem the bottom edge with 6" of penetration. It's a small round but better than nothing.
9mm. Man, they go so fast, you're not going to see a lot of expansion where it counts. The popular ones are 124g Golden Sabers, the 147g SXT's are OK. When I carry a 9mm, I carry 124g Federal Hydrashocks. A lot of them.
Both those rounds you need good shot placement or sheer volume of fire.
Just make sure that whatever defensive ammo you use that you can afford to blow through at LEAST a hundred rounds to ensure functionality. Don't buy a 25$ box of 25 Gold Dots, shoot 10 and assume it'll run perfectly. That's why I personally like Federal. For the most part, it's decent and cheap and I won't go broke shooting it. I guess the point is, don't buy a 25$ box of wonder ammo if you're afraid to practice with it...
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