Non-lethal deterrent: OC?

Discussion in 'Off-topic' started by Boy Racer, Nov 2, 2007.

  1. Boy Racer

    Boy Racer New Member

    Can someone suggest to me a good spray (like the Kimber stuff you see advertised every third page of the magazines these days) or something else a lady can carry besides a regulated item like pistols, knives and tasers? Who makes a good product?
  2. VolGrad

    VolGrad Tactical Statistician

    I am curious too.

    My wife has her GFL but will likely never carry. Basically, she got it because I asked her to, not because she wanted one. I had her read the Taser story Adam5 posted a while back. After she finally stopped laughing she said she wanted one. I looked up a couple I had seen in magazines and they were like $300+. Yikes.

  3. GunNut

    GunNut New Member

    Maybe if she knew all of her options. :D
  4. VolGrad

    VolGrad Tactical Statistician

    NEVER!!! .LOL. Some secrets are best kept to myself.
  5. S&W 40

    S&W 40 Active Member

    I had asked a similar question back last spring, can not find it now. MP did have a good recommendation.
  6. budder

    budder Moderator Staff Member

  7. VolGrad

    VolGrad Tactical Statistician

    I saw these at Clyde Armory the other day for around $35. I found a thread on THR about them. People seem to like them. For the price might be a good thing for the wife to carry in her purse or to leave in car for the road rage @$$hat who storms up to your window at the light. I am going to try to find some more info/testimonials on them. If all seem positive I will probably pick up a couple this week. If anyone knows anything pro/con about them, please share ASAP.

  8. ptsmith24

    ptsmith24 New Member

  9. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

    Natural Alternative

    projectile vomit.
  10. Macktee

    Macktee New Member

    Re: Natural Alternative

    That's what I was thinking...

    As recommended by no less an authority than the Illinois SP! Hoo Boy!!!

    :puke: :puke: :puke:

  11. Firearmz

    Firearmz New Member

    Pepper Spray is less lethal and only causes skin irritation, involuntary closure of the eye, and will also irritate the air way. If you ever have to use your OC Spray getting residual, back on you is a very real possibility and if you have not faced the unknown the consequences can be fatal. OC Spray causes physical and mental effects. The physical is a burning sensation, involuntary closure of the eye, and a runny clogged nasal passage. The mental aspects are fear and panic. This comes from the sense of not being able to breathe and not seeing. Voluntarily opening the eyes is almost impossible and you will have to assist your eye lids by holding them open. Even then, the vision is obscured by mucus on the eye so things will be blurry (and he burning is ever so present).

    I know it’s not pleasant but some types of training is just not a good time regardless it is important to feel and experience the effects in training rather than on the street for the first time.

    There are many types of OC on the market but I chose to stay away from the mixed stuff like OC and CS. I just use the straight OC because it is naturally biodegradable and requires no decontamination. Just cool water in the eyes and you are good to go in a few minutes. OC Sprays have two key things you want to look for:
    1. Percentage of Oleoresin Capsicum
    2. The Shcoefield heating units (SHU)

    The percentage of OC is going to tell you about how long the effects will last, 10% (maximum recommended for humans) will usually last about 40 minutes. The SHU will give you an idea of the intensity (burning). This will range from 50,000 to 5.3 million. I personally use a 10% 2 million SHU and have had good results.

    OC comes in four types of spray patterns, stream, cone and fog as well as foam. Each will have its benefits and drawbacks so you will have to choose your intended.

    Stream- carries further and works best in wind. How ever it does not atomize well and does not effect the respiratory system very well.
    Cone- does not work as well in wind but atomizes well and gets into all the cracks and crevices, eyes, head, ears and the respiratory system very well. Not recommended as a first choice for indoor use, it may very well carry through AC and Heating Vents.

    Fog- fog is best used out doors, for disbursing a lot of OC on quantities of people, again not a good choice for indoor use.

    Foam- foam is kind of like your shaving cream, it can be wiped off rather easily, thrown back at you, threw on the floor for you to trip on, although good for indoor use if you have nothing else.

    I use cone off work and stream inside the prison.

    There are many old wives tales of what will ease the burning and get rid of it’s effects ,personally I have tried the following:
    Sweet milk
    Johnson Baby Shampoo
    Sudecon wipes
    Let me go ahead and tell you cold water is best! There is one remedy that I have not tried, one part milk of magnesia and one part water and wash the face with it. Do not use any oil-based soaps or lotions it will cause more burning plus last longer.

    The brands I use are Body Guard LE10 on the street and Defense Technology First Defense at work.
  12. VolGrad

    VolGrad Tactical Statistician

    Ken - great info. So where does the Kimber product I linked to fall on your scale? It says it is 10% OC. Have no idea about the spray pattern, but from the descrip looks like it would be stream or cone? Also, do you have links to the products you recommended?
  13. Firearmz

    Firearmz New Member

    I have had no dealings with the Kimber Product. I also have no doubt that the pepper is good, but the method in which it works is my problem. I want it to spray as long as I depress the activator. for body guard Defense Technologies

    I carry the 1.47 oz can off work and a 2oz. can at work. The Fox labs stuff is good but I personally want it to last a little bit longer. Now if it was 5.3 million and 10% that would be great. :lol:
  14. ls1ssdavid

    ls1ssdavid New Member

    I got sprayed by 10% while in the Corps. Not sure of the brand name. Geeze I hated it. It's horrible.

    After I got sprayed I learned from a buddy who is a LEO that milk helps decon. I used milk on a Marine buddy after he got sprayed a few weeks after mine. The milk looked to work wonders in decontamination. I didn't know sweet milk was what you were supposed to use though Firearmz!?! If I ever have to get it again I will find sweet milk :wink:

    And when you shower after you get sprayed be careful. Wear swiming trunks and lean forward. Again don't let the run off get near your important parts.
  15. Firearmz

    Firearmz New Member

    Well you see in the south we have sweet milk and butter milk and thanks to the 5 x5's we came up with low fat milk, then the metro sexuals came up with 2% milk.. You carpet baggers may not have known that.
  16. legacy38

    legacy38 Well-Known Member

    First and foremost, the correct term is less-lethal and not non-lethal.

    Secondly, I hate the stuff. I can't envision anytime that I would use it in a confrontation. If a fight is inevitable, you might as well spray yourself in the face as well as you will get it all over you as well. Also, less-lethal should NEVER be considered an alternative to deadly force.

    The only time that I would use it on duty is in a barricaded suspect type situation. I will not use it once the fight is on or is inevitable.
  17. gsusnake

    gsusnake Token Liberal Hippie

    If I'm shooting anything at an assailant, it weighs 180 grains.

    Only less-lethal backup I would consider carrying is a contact weapon. Either a pocketknife, my Surefire (blindingly bright, plus the strike bezel) or an 8" baton, with which you can do a LOT of damage if you're trained.

    No spray. No taser. Nothing for the DA to say "But Mr. Snake, you had something you could have deterred your attacker with! You could have sprayed him with OC spray. Why did you shoot him 13 times? YOU'RE A BLOODTHIRSTY KILLER!"
  18. budder

    budder Moderator Staff Member

    You really need to work on your aim.
  19. legacy38

    legacy38 Well-Known Member

    The knife wouldn't be considered less-lethal.
  20. ICP_Juggalo

    ICP_Juggalo Professional Troll

    My wife carries Street-wise 17% O.C.

    You think that is sufficent enough?