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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This forum keeps popping up in Google searches, so I thought i'd join. I do have a few questions though.


1) Atlanta Library has a no firearms policy and I understand, GA has a preemption statute. Is this legal?


2) What banks allow open carry? I make it a practice, never to enter any establishment or do business that rejects my natural right to defend myself

3) What is the policy here about unconstitutional laws? I personally believe, due to the 2A and the supremacy clause, an unconstitutional law cannot by it's very nature be a law and has no duty to obey or submit to it.

Thanks in advance
 

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This forum keeps popping up in Google searches, so I thought i'd join. I do have a few questions though.

1) Atlanta Library has a no firearms policy and I understand, GA has a preemption statute. Is this legal?
Go to the gun laws page and review 16-11-127 (places off limits) and 16-11-173 (preemption). There, you will find your answer.

Please provide a little more information about this library policy.

2) What banks allow open carry? I make it a practice, never to enter any establishment or do business that rejects my natural right to defend myself
Almost none, but there are a few, and there are some threads here about them if you run a search.

3) What is the policy here about unconstitutional laws? I personally believe, due to the 2A and the supremacy clause, an unconstitutional law cannot by it's very nature be a law and has no duty to obey or submit to it.
GPDO has no policies. It is just a discussion forum. One of the rules discourages the discussion of illegal topics, but that is more aimed at protecting the existence of the forum, and it has never been applied to discipline posters writing about, for instance, carrying in off limits locations. If you want to discuss assassinating the President, that will be a different story.

Another example, firearm related, would be that it would not be appreciated for you to post up your video or pictures manufacturing a machine gun (that is, if you are not a SOT), because that is a federal felony. Such an act would send the government against the owners of this web site.

Discussion relating to the constitutionality of laws is the meat of discussion here, if that is what you are asking.
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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Welcome to the forum! I'm sure a few members will opine here on your questions. First stop...go review the applicable Georgia firearms laws. You can review them here, at the "Gun Laws" link. Also, www.georgiacarry.org has all the laws linked, at the bottom of the first page, and an excellent FAQ on the left menu is a good place to start too.

The following are my opinions, and you are encouraged to do further research to verify them.

1. Libraries are government controlled public property and are not off limits for carry. Libraries were at one time considered to be government entities, because sometimes, library boards met at them. Differing opinions abounded on that. But even if government entities, recent changes to the laws in 2014 requires government entities to have LEO supervised screening in place, for those locations to be off limits.

2. Every bank is a private business, and many have differing policies.

3. Not sure about what you mean about unconstitutional laws. That is a LONG journey into philosophy and the meaning of the 2nd Amendment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Go to the gun laws page and review 16-11-127 (places off limits) and 16-11-173 (preemption). There, you will find your answer.

Please provide a little more information about this library policy.
well for one, they have a checkpoint, which might change things. I've been in many places, i've never heard of a library, that does such things. Legal, yes. Moral, absolutely not

Almost none, but there are a few, and there are some threads here about them if you run a search.
uurgh. Just as well I prefer using the web ans smartphone apps.

GPDO has no policies. It is just a discussion forum. One of the rules discourages the discussion of illegal topics, but that is more aimed at protecting the existence of the forum, and it has never been applied to discipline posters writing about, for instance, carrying in off limits locations. If you want to discuss assassinating the President, that will be a different story.

Another example, firearm related, would be that it would not be appreciated for you to post up your video or pictures manufacturing a machine gun (that is, if you are not a SOT), because that is a federal felony. Such an act would send the government against the owners of this web site.

Discussion relating to the constitutionality of laws is the meat of discussion here, if that is what you are asking.
Well...... assassination is an extreme example but I get your point. That would be stupid in the extreme. I guess my argument is that there are no valid federal laws or even state laws that infringe on the right to bear arms. You make a valid point about protecting the forum though. Those who have control mechanisms in place do not like it in the slightest when that control is threatened, whether lawful or not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
1. Libraries are government controlled public property and are not off limits for carry. Libraries were at one time considered to be government entities, because sometimes, library boards met at them. Differing opinions abounded on that. But even if government entities, recent changes to the laws in 2014 requires government entities to have LEO supervised screening in place, for those locations to be off limits.
aaaah.... there are no LEOs there but as I stated in the previous post, there is a checkpoint, run by private security
 

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What happens at the Atlanta Library checkpoint? Any pat-downs? Is there a metal detector? If it beeps, do they make you remove anything metal and back through again?

Without a LEO present, I don't believe that can legally keep out a lawful carrier of a weapon.

Here's some low hanging fruit you can get them on: In Georgia a knife with a blade 5" and under in length is not considered a weapon. Go there carrying only a 4.5" bladed knife, and if they won't let you in, you can sue them, even if there were LEO present.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
What happens at the Atlanta Library checkpoint? Any pat-downs? Is there a metal detector? If it beeps, do they make you remove anything metal and back through again?

Without a LEO present, I don't believe that can legally keep out a lawful carrier of a weapon.

Here's some low hanging fruit you can get them on: In Georgia a knife with a blade 5" and under in length is not considered a weapon. Go there carrying only a 4.5" bladed knife, and if they won't let you in, you can sue them, even if there were LEO present.
Do you have a cite for that? I would love to get them for something legal. There is also the private property issue. Even if that knife isnt considered a weapon, there would have to be something in the OCGA that forbids them from just prohibiting all knives
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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I'm curious about this. Which library is this and what is the address?

I'm interested in doing a bit of research on this library checkpoint, because I had no idea any of them were doing this.
 

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Do you have a cite for that? I would love to get them for something legal. There is also the private property issue. Even if that knife isnt considered a weapon, there would have to be something in the OCGA that forbids them from just prohibiting all knives
O.C.G.A. § 16-11-125.1
Definitions

As used in this part, the term:

(2) "Knife" means a cutting instrument designed for the purpose of offense and defense consisting of a blade that is greater than five inches in length which is fastened to a handle.
and this

O.C.G.A. § 16-11-136
Restrictions on possession, manufacture, sale, or transfer of knives

(a) As used in this Code section, the term:

(1) "Courthouse" shall have the same meaning as set forth in Code Section 16-11-127.

(2) "Government building" shall have the same meaning as set forth in Code Section 16-11-127.

(3) "Knife" means any cutting instrument with a blade and shall include, without limitation, a knife as such term is defined in Code Section 16-11-125.1.

(b) Except for restrictions in courthouses and government buildings, no county, municipality, or consolidated government shall, by rule or ordinance, constrain the possession, manufacture, sale, or transfer of a knife more restrictively than the provisions of this part.
I think this is what you would need.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I'm curious about this. Which library is this and what is the address?

I'm interested in doing a bit of research on this library checkpoint, because I had no idea any of them were doing this.
Central Library. One Margaret Mitchell Square NW



Hopefully the image displays.
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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I emailed the Atlanta Library System Director. If I don't get a response soon, perhaps we can all come up with some Open Records Act Requests for them to get clarification on what they are doing, and to see if they are abiding within state law.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I emailed the Atlanta Library System Director. If I don't get a response soon, perhaps we can all come up with some Open Records Act Requests for them to get clarification on what they are doing, and to see if they are abiding within state law.
Indeed. For one, that checkpoint is totally unreasonable and in my opinion immoral and un-American. More on point, how does it affect carry rights that the checkpoint is manned by civilian security? Or is it the physical presence of a checkpoint that matters?
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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I emailed the Atlanta Library System Director. If I don't get a response soon, perhaps we can all come up with some Open Records Act Requests for them to get clarification on what they are doing, and to see if they are abiding within state law.
I've reread 16-11-127, and I don't see where a library can screen out all firearms. Private property owners can, government buildings can,
but from my reading, public buildings such as libraries can't prohibit lawfully armed citizens from the premises. There is no government entity involved. It's not a violation of law to enter a library while lawfully armed and carrying with a GWCL. It is just the library preventing carry with the security guards.
 

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The question is, does the library hold official meetings of any government entities. If so, they could ban licensed carriers of weapons if a LEO is supervising the checkpoints.

Perhaps a copy of any meeting minutes held there would be in order?
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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Malum? Gunsmoker? What are your thoughts?
 

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Deplorable bitter clinger.
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John Monroe?
 

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I think the library is a government building .
I think that if they have any screening or restrictions on the public access, that is enough for them to ban weapons-carrying private citizens with carry licenses .

However they cannot arrest you for attempting to go through the checkpoint unless :
number one : they have a certified police officer there as part of the security team,
and
number two: they have to give you a chance to leave and put your weapon in your car or otherwise remove your weapon from the building .

The sticky situation would be when you demand that they let you in, and you refuse to leave, but they do not attempt to arrest you. They just stop you at the checkpoint and tell you you can go no further. What are you going to do then?
At some point this stalemate could turn into an arrest for disorderly conduct , or an obstruction charge, interference with the operation of a government building, etc. blah blah blah, or something else .
I wouldn't be surprised if you got arrested for criminal trespass, although that should not be a valid charge if this is not private property .
 
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