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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
American Hunters and Shooters Association
http://www.huntersandshooters.com/

Think of them as the NRA that Kerry or Clinton would join.

From AHSA's website...
Moreover, an overwhelming majority of hunters support proposals like background checks to purchase guns, keeping military style assault weapons off our streets and the elimination of cop killer bullets.
The fact that they trumpet AWs and Cop killer bullets might clue some in to what they might be up to, here is a bit more about just the ASHA Foundation President John Rosenthal...

By Michael Blanding written in 2003 for Boston Magazine
Ever seen that gun-control billboard on the Mass. Pike showing the smiling faces of kids who were killed by handguns? That’s John Rosenthal’s work. Now he’s about to completely transform the face of Kenmore Square with an 885,000-square-foot complex that will bridge the highway itself. What’s that â€" a developer with a conscience?

This is the unlikely center of John Rosenthal’s life. An environmentalist and gun-control activist, he has pinned his future on an unsightly stretch of urban highway.
Boston.com says of Executive Director Bob Ricker...
Ricker has become executive director of a new group based in Washington, the American Hunters and Shooters Organization, that he says wants to promote responsible gun regulation. He calls it ''the progressive alternative to the NRA.
There you have it, the Democrat's and RINO's very own hunters club. They are admittedly against rifle accessories and illegal bullets, 2 subjects least likely to reduce violence but most likely to confuse voters into voting for them.
 

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Yeah, they go on news shows posing as the "pro-hunting/pro-Second Amendment" view.

Seriously.

:shakehead:

I heard them just this week.
 

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The unfortunate thing is that there are a lot of "gun apologists" out there. An organization like this could be used to make a tiny crack in the gun rights front into a split which would destroy the movement. This is kind of what happened in Britain: the shotgunners didn't care what happened to the pistol shooters, the pistol shooters didn't care what happened to guys who like AKs and ARs. They were split and easily conquered.

As I'm sure everyone on this sight would like to see all gun control all the way back to the NFA 1934 repealled. But do you realize how radical that now sounds? Even when sometimes defending the sunset of the AWB its hard not to sound like its ok that Class III weapons are regulated and outlawed. Obviously it isn't and anyone of our founding fathers would porbably be throwing hell and brimstone onto the spineless pols that brought us these onerous laws.

Organizations like this new one and the Freedome States Alliance are IMO marshalling their forces for a new democratic political success. After that happens BAM, we'll be lucky if guns with wooden curved "pistol grips" are still around.
 

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Two Points

First point: I think most hunters DO support bans on assault weapons and armor-piercing bullets, and Saturday Night Specials, etc. They support many kinds of gun control laws. Why? Because they don't know anything about gun control, or about their constitutional rights, other than what they see in the mass media. They are NOT serious shooters, or generally gun enthusiasts. They don't carry handguns for protection outside of their homes or vehicles. They most often not NRA members, and if they are, they don't worry too much about gun control, so long as they can get their sporting arms and ammunition to hunt and plink with.

Second point: All the anti-gun orgaizations and the "talking heads" that support this cause have said consistently, for the last 20 years or so, that the best definition of a "cop killer bullet" is one that will penetrate through the lowest-level kevlar vest ever put on the market. This includes centerfire rifle rounds. As most of us know, any round powerful enough to penetrate the shoulder bone of an elk at 200 yards will certainly go through an ordinary class 2A vest, much less the obsolete Class 1 that only has 15 or so layers of kevlar.

So to ban all "cop killer" bullets is to ban all big-game hunting in the USA.
How are they going to reconcile THAT?
 

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Re: Two Points

gunsmoker said:
Second point: All the anti-gun orgaizations and the "talking heads" that support this cause have said consistently, for the last 20 years or so, that the best definition of a "cop killer bullet" is one that will penetrate through the lowest-level kevlar vest ever put on the market. This includes centerfire rifle rounds. As most of us know, any round powerful enough to penetrate the shoulder bone of an elk at 200 yards will certainly go through an ordinary class 2A vest, much less the obsolete Class 1 that only has 15 or so layers of kevlar.

So to ban all "cop killer" bullets is to ban all big-game hunting in the USA.
How are they going to reconcile THAT?
They aren't, they don't care.

Ted Kennedy (you know the guy that killed that poor girl, and has the drunk son that's lucky he didn't follow in his father's footsteps) presented a bill to congress that would have either banned or restricted ammo which could penetrate armor. His example was .30-30, yeah, right the libs care about hunting too, so long as you do it with an air rifle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: Two Points

viper32cm said:
Ted Kennedy (you know the guy that killed that poor girl, and has the drunk son that's lucky he didn't follow in his father's footsteps) presented a bill to congress that would have either banned or restricted ammo which could penetrate armor. His example was .30-30, yeah, right the libs care about hunting too, so long as you do it with an air rifle.
His bill was for any rifle ammuntion that could penetrate the most common soft body armor used by police. However, the NIJ and the man who created kevlar body armor all say that soft body armor is not designed to stop rifle ammuntion. So yes, dispite his red faced denials on the floor, this would ban most rifle ammunition.

He got his examples from LEO's that had a bullet penetrate their vest as reported in the FBI's Crime statistics. All penetrations were rifle caliber.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Now that I have time, I will post where Teddy got his info from...

Law Enforcement Officers Killed and Assaulted
http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/killed/leoka03.pdf

Table 35 - Law Enforcement Officers Feloniously Killed with Firearms
Type of Firearm and Size of Ammunition that Penetrated Body Armor
1994-2003
Firearm/Ammunition - Total
Handgun - 0
Rifle - 19
.223 Caliber - 4
.30 Caliber - 2
.30-30 Caliber - 2
.300 Caliber - 1
7 Millimeter - 1
7.62x39 Millimeter - 9
Shotgun 0

Total - 19

It is broken down by each year in the link, this is just the total for 9 years. So in 9 years, 19 officers have died because their soft armor was penetrated. Every single one was a rifle round. So Kennedy goes after the ammo. (see how the table shows the ammo, so therefore the ammo is at fault)

What someone that has not drank himself stupid would do to find out more information after reading this is to ask... oh maybe the people that certify vests - the NIJ (National Institute of Justice.. the reseach, development, and evaluation agency of the US Department of Justice) "why are rifle rounds penetrating vests"? In which he would receive similar information that is availible on wikipedia that says soft armor is not designed to stop a rifle round.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_armor
 

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The really sad thing is that any kid that plays rainbow six knows that.

But US Senators, nah, they can't be bothered with such facts.
 
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