Marta has a long history of being off limits

Discussion in 'Places Off-Limits' started by Malum Prohibitum, Nov 27, 2006.

  1. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    It has been asserted here that Marta became off limits with a hijacking law passed in 2002. This assertion has been bothering me for some time. I used to carry on Marta in 2001 and prior, but then, I was exempt (leaving aside for now the debate over the differences in exemptions between 123 and 127). Because it has been bothering me, I went and did a little research, and it appears that carrying on Marta was a felony prior to 2002, even though the statute was rewritten in 2002.

    Here is the pertinent part of the statute as it was in 2001, prior to amendment:

    Any person who boards or attempts to board a bus or rail vehicle with a dangerous or deadly weapon concealed on or about his person or his property which is or would be accessible to such person while on the bus or rail vehicle shall be guilty of a felony and, upon conviction thereof, shall be sentenced to imprisonment for not less than one nor more than ten years. The prohibition of this subsection shall not apply to any person who is exempted under Code Section 16-11-130 or commercial security personnel who are in possession of weapons used within the course and scope of their employment; nor shall the prohibition apply to persons who are in the possession of weapons with the consent of the owner of such bus or rail vehicle, his agent, or the lessee or bailee of such bus or rail vehicle; nor shall the prohibition apply to persons transporting weapons contained in baggage which is not accessible to passengers on the bus or rail vehicle if the presence of such weapons has been declared to the transportation company.


    There are differences, but substantively, it is the same.

    Note that open carry does not appear to be addressed in either the new or the old statute, but 16-12-127 would appear to rule out that option in any event. O.C.G.A. 16-12-127 does appear to have been adopted in 2002.
     
  2. Gunstar1

    Gunstar1 Administrator

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    Well... half right is still better than all wrong. :D
     

  3. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    And it was enforced. Herndon v. State, 277 Ga.App. 374, 626 S.E.2d 579 (2006), involved the arrest of a man in 2000 for carrying a concealed weapon onto a Marta train (while already on parole for armed robbery and only two days after another robbery at gunpoint) for which he was sentenced to two years.

    Hey! It is safe to ride Marta disarmed!
     
  4. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    According to the publicly available crime stats, 3.04% of riders from July 1, 2006 to September 30, 2006 were victims of crime! (yes, you read the dates correctly).

    :shock:

    This includes 2 homicides, 22 aggravated assaults, and 25 robberies! (Yes, you read the numbers correctly)

    In addition, of course, there are mere property crimes, like auto theft and larceny (so defined for reporting purposes).

    It is safe to ride Marta, it's smarta!
     
  5. Gunstar1

    Gunstar1 Administrator

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    Didn't that guy that shot the judge and other people in the courthouse in Georgia (can't remember the name but he ended up taking a woman hostage and later let he go after she prayed for him, read him inspirational books, cooked him food, and gave him her stash of meth) get on a Marta bus to get away from the courthouse, after he shot the judge but before he killed that federal employee?
     
  6. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Looking at historical data, over the prior three years, there have been 272 robberies, not including the robberies mentioned above!

    Only one other homicide, though, in 2004. No more than one or two rapes a year. Make sure to bring the wife along when you ride Marta, it's smarta!
     
  7. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    A brutal knife slashing incident on the Atlanta MARTA commuter train, points up the common Public Relations issue of crime for transit companies in large cities. The knife attack started with an argument about a shell game on an evening commuter train. Atlanta commuter Brian Critchfield witnessed and wrote about the attack in the Atlanta Journal Constitution of 11/22/05.

    "A man in a tank top wanted to play but, apparently, wasn't welcome in the game. Then there was a screaming match ...People on the train began looking a little nervous. Suddenly, the two men were shoving each other and the man running the game pulled a knife and slashed the other's arm. There was substantial blood and it was gruesome.

    I tried to speak with the conductor via the intercom. I held the red button down and communicated in a clear voice that there was a knife fight on our car and provided the car number. My fearful wife, myself and several others then made a frantic crossing to the next car through the emergency door. The conductor never acknowledged my plea for help.
    It was at least three more minutes until we arrived at Lenox. No police were waiting at the station. The men got off and continued screaming at each other and chasing each other around. All the time, the conductor kept our train there with the doors open. The men, after two or three minutes of display, left the platform. The train doors closed and the train left. No MARTA or Atlanta police came to even take eye-witness statements. The conductor made no announcements.

    My wife has taken the train a couple of times since then. But she cannot help but think of that day when she was witness to a violent crime and no one came to her aid.

    We now haven't even the slightest confidence in the MARTA police force. "

    http://www.ajc.com/opinion/content/opin ... marta.html
     
  8. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    MARTA places helpful posters on all trains encouraging passengers to "move away from the source of trouble" and call MARTA police, who are practically invisible in the trains or stations.

    I have witnessed vagrants soliciting money from MARTA passengers and even stealing hundreds of tokens from subway turnstiles. Reporting these crimes resulted in a casual and indifferent response from the MARTA police. MARTA's indifference to the safety of transit commuters may lead to an increasing boldness among violent criminals. The MARTA crime statistics show a high incidence of assault in 2005 and even 1 murder in the 2004 crime rates.

    The MARTA approach to passenger safety has left the riding public feeling fear on MARTA trains. This is a striking example of how not to handle public relations related to a safety issue. MARTA has taken little responsibility for transit crime and the predictable result has been that MARTA now has a huge reputation for violent crime among residents, business travelers and tourists who visit Atlanta.

    http://prblog.edhillpr.com/2006_01_01_archive.html
     
  9. Macktee

    Macktee New Member

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    Don't forget, MARTA runs a lot of buses in addition to the trains...

    I'm betting most of the crime takes places on the buses. Am I right?

    I sure to hell hope I am as I ride the train but not the bus...!

    Anybody know what the statistics are concerning crime on the train?
     
  10. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Click on the links. They break down the crime by bus, train, parking lot, &c.
     
  11. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    http://www.hardenrealestate.com/info/at ... epark.html

    After the construction of Ga. 400 in 1990, the roads through Peachtree Park became dead ends, much more conducive to racing children than racing commuters.

    Although vehicles no longer have access across the highway to Peachtree Park, pedestrians do. The neighborhood convinced the State Department of Transportation to provide them with a landscaped pedestrian bridge connecting the neighborhood to Lenox Square, and thus giving the Peachtree Park residents a "back door" to one of Atlanta's most popular shopping malls. The 1999 murder of a Buckhead businessman crossing the bridge rattled some, but most see the bridge as a real neighborhood perk. "There was a little sentiment to close the bridge," explains Underwood, "but most people like its convenience." Gail and Randall Tolbert use the bridge all the time. "It's great this time of year," says Randall Tolbert, "especially when there is so little parking at Lenox."


    Um, as I recall, the video shows him running across the bridge from the MARTA station, closely pursued by his murderer.
     
  12. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    He ditched O'Briant's car in the garage here and then walked up and past CNN. No one noticed him. Then he worked his way up to the subway MARTA station, where police say he caught a train.
    http://cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP ... cd.02.html
     
  13. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Here is the Neal's Nuze version!

    http://boortz.com/nuze/200503/03142005.html

    :D
     
  14. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    There is actually a video of this that I remember seeing on TV news at the time, but I cannot find a link to it now. :cry:
     
  15. rajl

    rajl New Member

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    I seem to be the only person who has had good experiences with MARTA. I see MARTA cops at the stations regularly. Then again, I only ride the trains, and do so during day-time/peak hours, and only visit the stations at the nicer or denser neighborhoods (Dunwoody, Alpharetta, Mid-town, Downtown, Airport, Decatur). I'm not one to visit Bankhead while riding Marta.

    I actually know a Marta police officer. A nice guy and rather competent. In general, he represents the force very well. Anyway, he gave me some rather odd advice a few months back. He basically told me that even though MARTA bans weapons, if you feel in danger, you should carry anyway. I told him that the local DA's office might have a problem with that. His response was "Well ask the DA what you were supposed to do since the cops weren't around to protect you. He's only going to know that you were carrying if you were forced to use it to defend your life."

    While he's a good guy, needless to say I felt a little odd to hear something like that coming from the mouth of a MARTA cop.
     
  16. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    I know an ex-Marta LEO (still an LEO, just elsewhere now) who gives the same advice and claims there is a "look the other way" practice for well dressed, law abiding people who are armed on Marta.

    My advice? Who knows if you will run into that one guy who is just itching to arrest someone with an "illegal gun." Keep in mind that this is a felony with a 10 year sentence for the train itself, and a 20 year sentence for the building, parking lot, or within a "reasonable distance" adjacent to one of those Marta bus stops.

    :jail:
     
  17. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    Yeah, no offense to them, but I am not taking a chance with a felony.
     
  18. viper32cm

    viper32cm New Member

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    Not really an option for me either way since Marta's buses suck and that's the only way for me to get to school.

    Of course I'm disarmed by legislative command at school too, but at least I have my car.
     
  19. GAGunOwner

    GAGunOwner Active Member

    While you might be abe to carry on MARTA if you conceal well....occasionally I have seen MARTA Cops using dogs around the MARTA station. I have never seen these dogs on the trains or in the parking lots around MARTA but I have seen these walking around inside the station (5 Points). I assume that these are explosive detection animals. If one of these dogs hit on you, it would be a pretty public thing. I find it hard to believe that after the cops pat you down publically they'd just let you go.

    What are the odds that these dogs would hit on a pistol? This is one reason I wouldn't want to try to carry on MARTA.
     
  20. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    They'd have to be explosive detection dogs....if they were drug dogs they would loose their voice from all the barking. :D