Is a fine a conviction?

Discussion in 'Places Off-Limits' started by tommy901, Oct 27, 2016.

  1. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    First off, I am new to the forum...glad to find this one. I am 64 years old, no criminal record, no arrests etc.....I hold a current, in good standing, valid Georgia Real Estate license. I am having concerns about answering question 7 on the carry application. The last part of the question deals with "have you been convicted of carrying a weapon in an unauthorized location".

    Back in 1973, I had a shotgun in my truck in the gun rack inside the rear window...(gun was inoperable, trigger assembly had been removed as I was working on the part). The assembly was not in the vehicle, no ammo in the vehicle. I was on a Sunday afternoon ride and wound up visiting the Okefenokee Park. When I returned to my truck, an officer wrote me a ticket for having the gun in my truck. I was not arrested, gun was not confiscated, not handcuffed etc. A few days later, I received a letter from the court to appear or pay a $150 fine. I paid the fine. Never heard any more about this from that day.

    My question is, (1), will this show up in a background check? (2), should I answer YES to the question and use a separate sheet of paper to explain the situation? (3), how far does a background check go back?

    I have tried to search myself in county records and can't find anything about this.
     
  2. ForsythGlock

    ForsythGlock Member

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    I don't think you were "convicted" of anything. How do they know that YOU were even driving the truck? I think you are AOK to answer NO to the question.
     

  3. DonT

    DonT Deplorable bitter clinger.

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    Technically, a fine is a conviction, I believe. I'm not a lawyer, however. If it were me, I'd make a good effort to see if the jurisdiction still had a record of the fine/ticket I got on this. If I can't come up with anything through reasonable efforts, I would ask to see my probate court judge and explain the situation. He/she may advise me as to how to answer, and perhaps to go ahead with the application.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2016
  4. rmodel65

    rmodel65 Yukon Cornelius

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    And a ticket is an arrest..
     
  5. GAfirearmsReference

    GAfirearmsReference Weapons Law Booklet

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    Pull your own criminal history, and find out if this DNR wildlife violation is even listed.
     
  6. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    This. It is definitely a conviction, but of what? It does not sound like you were carrying anything in an unauthorized location. You were not even there.

    Anyway, this is a prohibitor that is limited for a number of years that does not reach back to 1973.
     
  7. Wegahe

    Wegahe NRA Instructor

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    Since computers were in short supply in 1973 it may have never been entered into the database due to the fact the fine was only $150.00. Many of the very minor offenses and even some major ones have never been entered into the database. Pull your BC and find out what is on it.
     
  8. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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  9. Nemo

    Nemo Man of Myth and Legend

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    Seems like he made 4 posts total then went away and never came back. Or he could have said no on his permit application and ended up in jail for perjury. Maybe planning on hunting you all down to provide extreme violence in your life for giving him bad info.

    Nemo
     
  10. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    This situation has been a thorn in my side since last October... and is still not resolved. I haven't submitted my application yet, but here's what I have been doing.

    First, I ran a background check on myself and it came back "no records found "....but I don't know how thorough internet checks are. Then I had some face to face discussions about all of this with some close deputy friends. Then I went to a county judge friend of mine in Florida, and most recently I spoke personally with my local probate judge. You would not believe some of the answers I've been given about this. One state trooper even sent word to me "not to worry about filling out the application because I could open carry anywhere in the state without the license". The county judge in Florida said to answer "no". (That those little towns didn't submit records on something like that back then). After explaining the event to the local probate judge, I didn't really get a clear understanding as to how I should answer, "but it would be checked into"....I explained that I was highly allergic to the jail, and lying to a judge.

    It seems to me that if I had been convicted of something, I would have known that a long time ago. (Yes, I paid a fine for having a non-working gun in my truck, in plain view etc,,in a place where guns are not allowed).... and that was it. Surely I would think there would have been further action taken. As stated originally, I was not arrested, not taken to jail, gun was not confiscated, etc, etc.

    Here's another thought, less than 3 weeks ago I bought a hand gun from a pawnshop and my application went through in just a couple of minutes. To me, that indicates quite a bit about my background history.

    Back to question 7: part of the question is "have you ever been convicted of carrying a weapon or long gun in an unauthorized location (y/n)? If so, have you served any portion of incarceration or probation for such offensive in the past five years or had any other conviction, guilty plea or nolo contendere plea within the past five years? y/n? If you have had no other conviction, attach proof of the date your term of probation, if any, was completed."......now, how am I supposed to answer that? According to this, I assume that if I was convicted, I should have been incarcerated, on probation and maybe served some jail time?

    At any rate, if I decide to go on with the process, I will update the outcome. Wish there was a box to check that said (maybe) or (not sure)....because I really don't have a clue where I stand with this. One would think that after 43 years, they would know if they had a conviction or not.
     
  11. mrhutch

    mrhutch Well-Known Member

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    Ianal, but if I were in your position I would answer no. If on the 1 in a million chance they decided you lied, it's easy to forget a silly ticket from over 40 years ago.
     
  12. Nemo

    Nemo Man of Myth and Legend

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    Glad for the update tommy. You have been busy. If you have not done it you might want to try your local sheriffs office and ask if they will do a check on you. They may do it but not give you a copy but only the info from it.

    Otherwise as you note I think you are probably good to go. With the real estate license and recent purchase if there were an issue I suspect that would have popped up at least for questions and more info requests.

    In any event, make a note you met with the judge and did not want to file bad or erroneous info and are trying to do the proper things and attach it to the application.

    I would also suggest you type up a summary of the situation where you paid the ticket/fine with as much additional detail on it as you can recall. A summary of your investigation would not be bad to show your anti-allergy actions. Have it ready to provide to the judge should it be needed.

    Another option (and probably better) would be to meet up with and attorney for a consult and assistance. You do real estate, you know dozens. There are a few around here also. You may already know who them and might not realize it.

    As far as answering no and relying on forgetfulness, the internet never forgets and you open yourself to an additional perjury charge if it goes wrong. That is bad.

    Nemo
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2017
  13. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    Thanks Nemo, you must have been reading my mind! My next move was to meet with the sheriff back where I was born and raised in Florida. He and I are close friends, and I think he will run a check for me. I never knew something that seemed so easy to discern would turn out to be so complex. Maybe I'm just going overboard with this, but I want to get to the bottom of this. I assume a background check done from Florida would be the same and as thorough as Georgia would be?
     
  14. Adam5

    Adam5 Atlanta Overwatch

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    You said that you spoke with your local Probate Judge. What did he/say? He/she is one that will issue or deny an application.
     
  15. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh, so this was in Florida?

    Go here.

    https://web.fdle.state.fl.us/search/app/default?0
     
  16. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    The probate judge was very attentive to our conversation and seemed to also be concerned as to why there was no further action taken about this....being that I was not arrested or charged with anything and just given a ticket. The judge then pulled out a copy of the application and looked at question 7, and didn't really say much more about the event, other than writing down my name and noting that we talked about this. Said it would be looked into if I proceeded with the application.
     
  17. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    Malum, I can't imagine anyone that has read this post could come to the conclusion that anything about this event happened in Florida.
     
  18. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Um, you were talking to a county judge in Florida.
     
  19. tommy901

    tommy901 New Member

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    Malum, thanks for the info, this is informative!