Florida Cop Convicted

Discussion in 'In the News' started by Nemo, Mar 7, 2019.

  1. Nemo

    Nemo Man of Myth and Legend

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    of manslaughter. The one who killed the guy broke down on the side of the interstate. Cop, no uniform, no ID shown or stated and not cop van approached, guy figured robbery, drew, cop drew, fired, and killed him.

    This may have been discussed here before. Was it good response by civilian, bad shoot by cop, bad involvement by cop or what?

    Nemo

    https://thehill.com/homenews/state-...r-found-guilty-faces-life-in-prison-for-fatal

     
  2. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    Even if Officer Raja (looks mixed race, part Indian and part white) didn't ID himself as a cop, does that matter? Can't any one of US stop to offer aid to a broken down motorist at 3 a.m.?

    What I want to know is who drew a gun first, and why.

    If Corey Jones (the black "church drummer" who'd been playing at a bar and smoking dope that evening) pulled or brandished his gun, WRONGLY and UNREASONABLY, thinking Raja was a criminal about to rob him, does that give Raja the right to use deadly force to save himself?
     

  3. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    But, it looks like Ofc. Raja blew it by choosing to lie and plant false evidence to frame the dead citizen, with Raja going with the simple and seemingly more believable story of " He pulled a gun on me for no reason, and I told him I was a cop and drew my own gun, then irdered him to drop his, but he looked like he was about to open fire on me, so I had to shoot first."


    Raja's false (planted) evidence was him screaming into his cellphone "put the gun down" after he'd already finished shooting down the motorist.
     
  4. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Apparently, Raja approached by driving the wrong way up an access ramp, and a recording, about which Raja was unaware when he concocted his false cover story, shows him approaching Jones aggressively for no reason.

    When Raja invented that cover story during his interview with investigators, he didn’t know about the audiotape of Jones speaking with a roadside assistance dispatcher. That tape undercut every element of his defense, from the moment Raja approached the van to when he claimed that he called 911.​

    https://www.sun-sentinel.com/opinio...olice-officer-raja-guilty-20190307-story.html


    Oops!

    He said he know Jones drew his gun because its laser was pointed at him. Turns out Jones' little .38 has no laser . . .

    Oops!

    The judge flat out called Officer Raja a liar at his Stand Your Ground hearing.
     
  5. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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  6. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    What’s on the roadside assistance call?

    The audio starts with loud chimes from Jones’ open car door and Jones says, “Huh?” as Raja approached him.

    “I’m good. Yeah, I’m good,” Jones said.

    “Really?” Raja responded. “Yeah,” Jones said.

    At that point, Raja begins screaming, “Get your f------ hands up! Get your f------ hands up!”

    “Hold on! Hold on!” Jones insists.

    “Get your f------ hands up! Drop!” Raja said.

    Within the next two seconds, the first volley of gunshots is heard on the recording.

    Did Jones fire his gun?
    Jones’ pistol, found 41 yards away from his body, was never fired, investigators said.


    . . .


    One bullet, which hit Jones’ chest, was fatal, while other shots were fired at a fleeing Jones and Raja must have known by that point that Jones was unarmed.

    Raja “chose to gun down Corey Jones” despite the lack of a threat, they say.
     
  7. Malum Prohibitum

    Malum Prohibitum Moderator Staff Member

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    Prosecutors believe Jones pulled his gun and tried to get away. Raja fired three shots; Jones ran down an embankment. Prosecutors said he threw his gun, found 125 feet (38 meters) from his body, but Raja fired three more times, 10 seconds after the first volley. Jones was killed by a bullet through his heart.

    A medical examiner testified Jones would have dropped feet from where the fatal shot struck him. He also was shot once in each arm.

    Prosecutors said Raja, not knowing of the tow-truck dispatcher recording, tried to deceive investigators. He told them in a video-recorded interview hours after the shooting he said "Police, can I help you?" as Jones jumped from the SUV. He told investigators Jones leapt backward and pointed his gun, forcing him to fire. Raja said Jones ran but turned and again pointed his gun, forcing him to fire the second volley.
     
  8. Craftsman

    Craftsman Well-Known Member

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    Gee, I wonder why there is a narrative of LEO types, including prosecutors or former prosecutors, that always try and badmouth victims of police violence to make such violence appear justified. Surely that never happens in real life.. or on a web forum.
     
    MRD likes this.
  9. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    Craftsman did you have anything intelligent to say in your comment?

    I said in my original post that I want to know who pulled their weapon first and for what reason.
    Do you know the answer to that question? I think it's important --don't you ?


    I also think that somebody who smokes marijuana and smoked some on that evening is more likely to react in a paranoid and aggressive manner when dealing with others. And if (if) the person who is confronting you claims to be a cop, that would give you a reason to oppose that cop. You'd be thinking the cop can arrest you for driving while intoxicated, the cop could search your car and find your stash of marijuana, the cop might question you, leading you to exposing the source of your marijuana and get you in big trouble with the local pot dealer...

    Marijuana impairs your judgment it makes you do stupid and impulsive things that you would not normally do . Possessing illegal drugs also motivates people to do violent acts they would not otherwise do.
     
  10. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    I don't know how it actually happened. But I'm saying that based on just reading the first couple posts in this thread that it could have been a gray area in the law when it comes to the initial use of force, the first three shots. But the cop lied and tampered with the evidence and thus ruined any self-defense claim he might've ever had .

    We hear gun nuts on chat sites like this announced that they intend to do the same type of thing . "If I see somebody prowling around my yard I'm going to shoot first! If it turns out they don't have a weapon, I'll make sure there's a weapon next to the body before the cops arrive!"


    "If you use deadly force make sure the suspect ends up dead don't leave him alive to tell a story that contradicts yours. Make sure you're the only living witness to talk about what happened."


    "If you shoot a burglar outside your home and you realize that it doesn't look so good, drag him into the home! That way you're on firmer legal ground."

    These three statements above( which we often see in websites like this) are all situations where what may have been a gray area use of force becomes clearly illegal and the person will be convicted.

    You can't use self-defense when you lie about the circumstances of what happened . It won't be successful; your attempt to justify your acts will be rejected .
     
  11. a_springfield

    a_springfield Well-Known Member

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    Does it really matter who had a gun out first?
    If a car approached me the wrong way at night while I am broke down, yes I will have a gun out. If said driver of car gets out like the recording shows, I am going to have said gun ready.
    Based on the recording and fabricated evidence and the running down the victim to shoot him more, even if he at this point tried to shoot back in self defense, the cop murdered the man.

    If the cop felt threatened by the mere presence of a gun he should not have been a cop. This is just further fuel for the us vs them felling that lot of cops have.
     
    MRD likes this.
  12. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    HYPOTHETICAL:

    Suppose you are an armed private (non-gov't) Citizen openly carrying a pistol holstered on your hip. At 3:00 in the morning you see what looks like a motorist broken down on the side of the highway, flashers on, and the driver is standing next to his vehicle .

    You are driving too fast & noticed him too late to stop behind the other car.

    You assess the situation as you drive-by and you decide to render assistance. So you brake hard, swerve into the shoulder lane, and then quickly back up to right in front of the stopped vehicle.

    As you get out of your vehicle, the driver standing by the broken down car notices your holster and gun. Nervous, he pulls up his shirt and puts his hand on his pistol tucked in his belt.

    What do you do?
    What are you likely to do?
    What should you do?
     
  13. Nemo

    Nemo Man of Myth and Legend

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    Raise hands above shoulders, holler at him to the effect-- hey man, just stopped to see if I could help, you want me gone give me 3 steps and I'm outta here, don't want no problem-- then turn around a haulassouttathere.

    Nemo
     
  14. a_springfield

    a_springfield Well-Known Member

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    I get out of my vehicle and while standing there ask if they need help. I don’t approach them instantly after driving the wrong way. They already saw me drive past then stop. If they say say they are ok and don’t need help, I get back in my car and leave. I don’t say “really” “get you f ing hands up” bang bang bang. Then chase down the stranded motorist and shoot them more.

    If they presented a gun in a non threatening manner I might first try and deescalate the situation, I would not have approached more than getting out to being with. But I for sure would not run them down and shoot them more then make a call to cover my actions.
     
  15. moe mensale

    moe mensale Well-Known Member

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    Where are you coming up with this claim? Hypothetical on your part because "all black reggae musicians do drugs" or do you have an actual link to some article saying so?
     
  16. Phil1979

    Phil1979 Member Georgia Carry

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    Then I'm an idiot at the outset. Since I'm not an idiot, I don't fly in there and brake hard like a bat out of Hades with an openly carried pistol. I drive on safely and call for assistance or assume he has a cell phone and can do the same.



     
  17. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    ARTICLE FRIM FLORIDA CHANNEL 10 NEWS: https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&sou...aw3A2oup9y84mTFLPH1zrV5m&ust=1552156910386321

    QUOTE: "The first witness for the prosecution was Matthew Giles-Huntsberger, who was in a band with Jones and had been with him hours earlier during a performance. Giles-Huntsberger testified that he and Jones had smoked marijuana together during a break."
     
  18. Craftsman

    Craftsman Well-Known Member

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    Note to gunsmoker: Reefer Madness was not a documentary. The only people stoners are paranoid about is cops out to kill or incarcerate them for possessing a plant.