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American
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3,289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Seriously, how can you be this illiterate about our laws and legal system. The FL change makes the state have to follow the "innocent until proven guilty" or at least "innocent until enough evidence to indict" standard is followed in SYG cases.

One commentator (who is a retired attorney) writes this though:

"Already weighted heavily in favor of trigger-happy shooters (freed of any duty to retreat), new changes to the law will not only increase shootings but discourage legitimate prosecutions.

Previously, shooters charged with a crime - bear in mind, many acts of self-defense never result in criminal charges - could obtain immunity at a pretrial hearing if they were able to show, by a "preponderance of the evidence" (the lowest evidentiary standard), that the shooting was justified.

Now, that's been turned upside down. Bent on giving shooters an even better shot at immunity, lawmakers have mandated that the government, in pretrial hearings, must demonstrate the exact opposite; namely, that defendant's self-defense claim is totally meritless. And, they must do so pursuant to a decidedly higher evidentiary standard ("clear and convincing evidence")."
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"If this revised law, as anticipated, results in a substantial spike in stand your ground cases, allowing more miscreants (and vigilante types) to be shielded from prosecution - again, not to be confused with citizens having legitimate self-defense claims (who are rarely charged) - it's not going too far to say that Florida lawmakers will have real blood on their hands. I hope I'm way off base, but the history of this misguided, ill-conceived law suggests otherwise."

http://www.gainesville.com/opinion/20170629/carl-ramey-on-guard-against-stand-your-ground
 

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American
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3,289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
https://www.local10.com/lifestyle/l...ground-law-unconstitutional-miami-judge-rules

MIAMI - Florida's revised "stand your ground" law is unconstitutional, a Miami County judge ruled Monday. Miami-Dade County Judge Milton Hirsch ruled that lawmakers overstepped their authority by revising the self-defense law, putting the burden of proof on prosecutors.

According to Ballotpedia, "Hirsch, a Chicago native, worked as a CPA before receiving his J.D. degree from the Georgetown University Law Center. He currently serves as an adjunct professor at the University of Miami."

I am speechless. How can this individual can sit on a bench and say stuff like that without fear of being tagged as a moron and removed for cause? If he cannot understand the principle of Separation of Powers, he does not need to wear the black robe.
 

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Man of Myth and Legend
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15,135 Posts
That law is unconstitutional. Fl Supreme Court should craft that law, not legislature.

Nemo

https://www.local10.com/lifestyle/l...ground-law-unconstitutional-miami-judge-rules

Florida's 'stand your ground' law unconstitutional, Miami judge rules
Judge says Florida Supreme Court, not lawmakers, should have crafted law
By Peter Burke - Local10.com Managing Editor, Madeleine Wright - Reporte, Posted: 9:59 AM, July 03, 2017 Updated: 12:23 PM, July 03, 2017

MIAMI - Florida's revised "stand your ground" law is unconstitutional, a Miami judge ruled Monday.

Miami-Dade County Judge Milton Hirsch ruled that lawmakers overstepped their authority by revising the self-defense law, putting the burden of proof on prosecutors.

Hirsch ruled that the Florida Supreme Court, and not the state Legislature, should have crafted the law.

"The statutory alterations in the burden and standard of proof in 'stand your ground' cases are, as set for hereinabove, unconstitutional," Hirsch wrote in his 14-page order.

. . .
 

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American
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3,289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·

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Man of Myth and Legend
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15,135 Posts
Yeah, but mine is only 8 minutes behind yours. I was researching, crafting and editing mine when yours went up. It was not there when I started. Sorry. But I think each has relevant related info the other does not.

Nemo
 

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American
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3,289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Yeah, but mine is only 8 minutes behind yours. I was researching, crafting and editing mine when yours went up. It was not there when I started. Sorry. But I think each has relevant related info the other does not.

Nemo
Glad that we're on the same page. Amazing what some judges think is within their purview.
 

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GeePeeDoHolic
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6,413 Posts
Lawmakers overstepped their authority by making a law? The judicial branch is absolutely worthless.
 

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Member Georgia Carry
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Well, the Florida Supreme Court did rule that the Florida Legislature's ban on open carry was constitutional, so it's no surprise they get something else bass-ackwards.
 

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American
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3,289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well, the Florida Supreme Court did rule that the Florida Legislature's ban on open carry was constitutional, so it's no surprise they get something else bass-ackwards.
But this was a lowly county court judge, about 3 levels below the state Supreme court, that usurped legislative authority.
 

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Registered
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14,956 Posts
Miami-Dade County. The judge probably has a Janet Reno shrine in his office.

Does his ruling mean that legislators can rule on the constitutionality of their new laws?
 

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GeePeeDoHolic
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6,413 Posts
Makes me think of some legislature somewhere that put in their bill that the law could not be reviewed by judiciary.
 
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