Detaining some one at gun point

Discussion in 'General GWL Questions' started by NetAdminWithGun, Apr 18, 2007.

  1. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    No I didn't, but the thought crossed my mind.

    If i was in georgia, i probaly would have.


    I took my new girlfriend up to tennesee to see her family. One night as we are driving back to the hotel, we see a car pull out from the left side of the intersection and start traveling our direction but on the wrong side of the road.

    The car then begins to run 3-6 cars off the road (we are behind him by about 50 yards), we are on a 4 lane road (2 lanes each way, 10 feet of grass median) he then swerves over to our side, then back over to theirs and runs a couple more off the road.
    *Note: Everyone i have talked to about this says they wouldn't have done what I am about to do.

    My girlfriend was driving, I told her to pass the vechile and stop the car. She does so and forces the driver onto the shoulder and to a stop. I get out (IWB beretta 92fs concealed) and approuch the car.

    The driver opens his door, its 2 drunk mexicans. I ask if they are alright, they say "no problem", i asked if they lived far because we could escort them home or something. They say "no problem", about now is when i realize these guys dont speak english, and are trashed. I try to explain that i would not let them drive like this. After about 5 minutes i tell my girlfriend to call the police, the driver steps out of his car. (he has about 3-4 inches on me and at least 80-100 pounds(not good)). He reaches behind his back (really not good) I start laughing (remeber they dont speak english) and take a step back. He slams the door and TAKES OFF!. (For some reason out of instinct I draw and aim at the back window (I still dont know why). I start flippen out because if this was georgia i knew i could have at least detained him but this was a different state and i didn't want to find out the hard way i was wrong. If he had slammed into a family or something i never would have forgiven my self for not breaking the law if it was against the law.

    So I jump in the driver seat and try to catch up to him, my girlfriend is on the phone with the police and i ask her to ask them if i can stop this guy because he is going to kill some one. They say no i can't.

    3 Minutes later teh mexicans pull into a nice houses's drive way and turn off their lights. I pull over to the side of the road and just wait. (no dome lights came on so they couldn't have gotton out) 10 minutes later they figure out they didn't outsmart me and start back onto the road.

    1/2 mile down the road...4 squad cars come flying by me and pull over the car.

    I was talking to the officer and he said that i shouldn't have tried to stop him because i could have ended up with a knife if my stomach. (My girlfriend KNEW i was biting my tonque) he said we did what was best and sent us on our way.

    If he had slammed into some one i would have been so pissed off.

    2 questions:

    What line would you draw it at detaining some one at gunpoint?

    and

    Would any of you have done the same thing? Everyone says they would have called the police, and left.


    Also, this is why i now carry OWB and go to the IDPA matches. I know he was drunk, but i don't want to find out the hard way that he can still out draw me.
     
  2. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    I would have called the police the second I saw him on the wrong side of the road. Every second counts.
     

  3. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    My hand was on it, thumb break off , when i carry concealed its behind my jacket and on my4-5 o'clock. Right next to my wallet :)

    I left that part out, sorry.
     
  4. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    I was HOPING it was just some dumb person, i'm not really one for calling the police.
     
  5. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    Just a dumb person running people off of the road on the wrong side of the road?.....c'mon......


    I'm not trying to be an asshole, but I know that is how the above sentence is gonna come off though.
     
  6. pro2am

    pro2am New Member

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    I've chased/tailed drunks while on the cell phone with the cops...even to the point of flashing my lights to try and warn other drivers while doing it.

    But hold someone at gunpoint? Nope. I believe I would also be going "downtown" for any number of violations if I did that. I don't believe that pulling the gun out falls under the imminent danger of great bodily injury reason. (yes, even though I know that drunk drivers can kill people)
     
  7. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    holy crap that is my worse night mare.

    I am sorry you had to go through that.
     
  8. glockgirl

    glockgirl New Member

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    I was in my big dang truck (F350 superduty crew cab long bed dually) and a car was running everyone off the road... I was tempted to run him off (it was a festiva type little car)but thought better of it... I called the cops and evidently so did everyone around me... the guy almost flipped off a bridge.. after 40 min of this the cops still hadn't showed up
     
  9. gunsmoker

    gunsmoker Lawyer and Gun Activist

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    No Gun Use

    I like the idea of following drunk drivers and calling the cops, and making a note of what traffic violations they commit so that you can be the star witness in court against them later.

    I am not comfortable with the idea of trying to pull them over or force them off the road. What are you trying to do-- a citizen's arrest? What would happen if you found out that the driver was not drunk but having a seizure or something?

    I think the gunplay was totally over the line. Your concealed gun should stay concealed. You can't brandish it while confronting a suspected drunk driver. You aren't a cop and you aren't doing a felony take-down of suspected bank robbers. When the bad guy flees, he's not threatening you, so you cannot aim at him. I would say that you cannot legally even try to shoot out his tires, since that could be an aggravated assault against him and his passenger (who may be wholly innocent).

    The only scenario where your gun should come into view is if you verbally (not physically) confront a suspected drunk driver and he then attacks you or threatens to attack you in a way that you reasonably think endangers your life & limb. Then you can shoot him. Not for drunk driving, but for committing a violent felony against you that you had to end immediately.
     
  10. Watch_Their_Hands

    Watch_Their_Hands New Member

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    Like Glockgirl, I have called the cops many times while driving HWY 129N (NE GA) close to Clermont where we live. Several times for speeding drunks running people off the road, and once for a drunk teen that ran my wife's car of the road with all four of us in it. The cops never showed up once accept for the last incident, and they only ticketed the teen for reckless driving, not DUI. I could smell the beer on her breath...


    So far as what you did NetAdminWithGun, :censored: that. Unless I see someone kill somebody or actually rob someone, I would do nothing more than call the cops. Hell, maybe they'd even show up in a few hours. I don't get paid to risk mine or my families neck.
     
  11. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    If anything you just backed up my actions more then protested against them.

    If he was having a seizure I would have called an ambulance, that would have gotton there alot faster then a cop that was called because of some one "running people off the road". Who then would have called the ambulance.

    It seems that most people i talk to have the same view, they felt they shouldn't get involved because it wasn't their "job". Just sit back and honk your horns. (reference to other post)
     
  12. qre2457

    qre2457 New Member

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    Maybe you would have called an ambulance, maybe not. In their right mind, these people would not have been driving impaired. I remember hearing an officer talk about a "drunk driver" who hit a few cars, wild driving, etc. Eventually he is stopped and acting wild. Long story short, he was diabetic. While driving, his blood sugar dropped causing severe mental confusion. Fortunately the officers had enough backup that no one acted hastily despite his attacking the officers. Had this happened to a private person acting alone, they would have probably shot him.

    My opinion is if you want to be in law enforcement, pull people over, detain them, etc, become a police officer.
     
  13. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    Big +1
     
  14. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    bah, the pay sucks, and the politics are even worse.

    some of you may be able to live with the fact that if some one dies because you were to much of a coward to do anything. I on the other hand wouldn't be able to.

    And police have to inforce laws, most of which i dont agree with.

    But i'm starting to think I'm a little off since it seems almost everyone disagrees with me and wouldn't have gotten involved.

    Would you (in theory) get involved if you saw a gang attacking some one in an alley? I'm going to assume most of you would just call the police and carry on with your life, and that is really sad.

    I understand most people on here carry to protect themselves and their family, does no one else do it to possibly protect anyone else? After columbine I started carring my rifle in my trunk when i went to high school. Most would think that was crazy, does anyone else see the reasoning behind this?

    you guys make me think i'm crazy :)
     
  15. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    oh i forgot to mention.

    I'm batman.
     
  16. Rammstein

    Rammstein New Member

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    Now hold on right there.

    I am no coward. I would intervene if a gang of people start beating someone up in an ally, but I would call the police first.

    When you talk about running cars off the road and holding drunk drivers at gun point YOU are crossing the line. Like someone said, if you want to be a cop go the academy and be a cop. But don't think that just because the state of Georgia allows you to carry a gun that you have to get involved in EVERYTHING. You pulled a gun on a car that was driving away for christ sake.

    There is a huge difference between stopping an attack and trying to play police man.
     
  17. NetAdminWithGun

    NetAdminWithGun New Member

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    Like i said , i didn't hold them at gunpoint, the thought never crossed my mind UNTIL he stepped out of the car and had his hand behind his back.

    The drawing while he was speeding away, i really really can't explain that. It was more like a reflex then anything else.

    My 2 questions were, what line would you have drawn at holding them at gun point, and would you have stopped them.

    And ramm i didn't mean you were a coward, in all honesty i thought you would be one of the ones to say you would have stopped them as well.

    And i'm SHOCKED MP hasn't posted on this. He is normally the first to tell me everything i did wrong :)
     
  18. qre2457

    qre2457 New Member

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    There is a huge difference between you, a single person, vs. multiple officers. They have guns, pepper spray, taser, etc. You have..a gun. A confrontation with the officers may result in death, a confrontation with you WILL end in death. In reality, your actions have also put someone at an unnecessary risk of death when there is a much better alternative.

    The analogy you give does not work. A group actually attacking someone is an immediate attack. A drunk driver is a threat but fortunately at night there are not as many people on the road.

    How would you feel if you ended up shooting a person having a seizure, Alzheimer's, etc? Sure you could convince yourself that you might have saved a life, but the flip side is you took an innocent one yourself. I would not want to be explaining that one in a criminal or civil court.

    Even if it was a drunk driver, I would have a hard time not viewing the actions as escalating things. Unless he had hurt someone, I would not view your actions well especially if you killed them. Then again, I have issues with non-LEOs who hold someone at gunpoint who is trying to steal a car or who enter their house to clear it after an apparent robbery.