[phantoms]

The Department of Defense is considering using bullpup rifles in the future. Todd South explores the pros and cons at SHOT Show 2018 in Las Vegas.

https://www.armytimes.com/video/2018/01/25/bullpup-rifles-are-they-worth-it/

 

[phantoms]

That was from Army times (video). Here's a short article from Marine Times - https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/of...several-gun-makers-have-solutions-if-it-does/

This past fall, officials with the Army Maneuver Center of Excellence's lethality branch laid out several concepts being considered for the Army's Next Generation Squad weapon and likely new designs for the ultimate replacement for the M4.

Some of those include major advancements to the fire controls and a likely change in caliber. But one was a possible bullpup design.


Also, take a look at The Army's Next Generation Squad Weapon could change the way you fight

 

[Fallschirmjäger]

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with a bullpup action, so long as it has a magazine designed to be used in a bullpup. HK's G-11 and FN's P-90 have magazines which lend themselves very well to a bullpup action.

There are even bullpups with adjustable stocks, which is helpful in the wide variety of environments the military finds itself in these days.

 

[DonT]

Some quite interesting concepts being explored in these articles. Perhaps there are some good ideas here. But as newer gun concepts are explored, I would always keep asking two key questions: 1) How much will any of the gosh darn things weigh, to include the ammunition, batteries, etc., that the average grunt will need to lug around? 2) Will any of these new gee whiz guns, marvelously capable and all, actually withstand the punishment that the average grunt can and will visit upon them in a field environment? During actual combat conditions of dusty, rainy, muddy, etc? If we keep breaking them, what good are they?

I sure hope sane and common sense minds within the grunt community, good Army soldiers and Marines and Navy SEALs all, will keep asking those questions at every stage. Oftentimes, those questions and the uncomfortable answers, seem to be set aside.

 

[gunsmoker]

The Mobile Infantry already uses them.
They worked well against bugs.

 

[Mrs_Esterhouse]

I hate bullpups more than I hate the NRA.

 

[phantoms]

I think the Tavor is an amazing weapon. As for the mags, it uses standard GI mags and has not a lick of problems with them. The IDF has used them since 2001 and love them.

They are much shorter than a standard M4, much better balanced, easy to clean/maintain and much better suited to close combat/door-to-door operations.

The problems I see with adopting them are in having to retrain all soldiers basic instincts on mag changes and handling. That is no small thing.

 

[DKW]

Over the past several years, I have become interested in getting a bullpup rifle. One of my main concerns (and I would like to know how countries that use bullpups for their armed forces deals with this issues) is how they deal with LH shooters.

Some bullpups address this in ways that don’t affect if the shooter is LH or RH (such as downward ejecting or forward ejecting cases), but most (such as the Tavor, you have to completely change the bolt in order to eject out the opposite side. I don’t see the army to buy both LH and RH versions.

At least with normal rifles, a LH shooter can adjust reasonably easy to shoot RH “normal” rifles but bullpups are a different story.

I personally have been thinking of buying an IWI X95 in their LH version but hesitant for problems of potential resell.

 

[phantoms]

but most (such as the Tavor, you have to completely change the bolt in order to eject out the opposite side. I don't see the army to buy both LH and RH versions.

The new Tavor 7 (7.62) is one of the easiest weapons to convert from right to left hand use. Wish all guns were this easy.

Me wants....;.

 

[DKW]

The new Tavor 7 (7.62) is one of the easiest weapons to convert from right to left hand use. Wish all guns were this easy.

Me wants....;.

I saw this also. Unfortunately it only comes in 7.62. Hopefully they will make the X95 interchangeable in the future.

I saw a video from MAC on the Desert Tech MDR in which is it LH/RH interchangeable. I don't think this is out yet and either way I am not spending $2K plus on it. I can't remember if it comes it 5.56 either.

I don't mind buying a LH bullpup set up for my use. What I am worried about is potential re-sell (if I ever want to) because finding the right buyer could be difficult.

 

[ed4]

FN FS2000 is ambidextrous out of the box, but I think it's been discontinued.

 

[hammerg26]

X95 is an amazing weapon. I love mine.

 

[Scout706]

. . . The problems I see with adopting them are in having to retrain all soldiers basic instincts on mag changes and handling. That is no small thing.

Has the Army - or Marine Corps - incorporated mag changes into Annual Weapons Qual? I got out in '08, never did a mag change at the range, not as part of Qual.

 

[Fallschirmjäger]

The problems I see with adopting them are in having to retrain all soldiers basic instincts on mag changes and handling. That is no small thing.

Didn't the military go through the same thing when they

• switched from the matchlock to the flintlock
• switched from the flintlock to the percussion cap
• switched from the percussion cap to the breech-loader (e.g. Springfield Trapdoor)
  
• switched from the breech-loader to a clip fed magazine rifle (M1903)
  
• switched from a magazine fed rifle to to a clip loaded rifle (M1)
  
• switched from a clip loaded rifle to a detachable magazine fed rifle? (M14)

I don't think it's going to be an insurmountable task.

ETA: I have tube fed shotguns and rifles, magazine fed ARs, a PS90 that uses a horizontal magazine laying atop the weapon, and a break-open shotgun. I don't think any instinctual behaviors are delaying my reloading processes.

 

[gunsmoker]

Haven't many other nations switched to a bullpup rifle for their military forces?
Steyr AUG, back in the 1980s.
FAMAS, used by France since the 1970s.
L85, used by the British since the late 1980s.
QBZ-95 or just "Rifle, Type 95" used in China.

 

[Mrs_Esterhouse]

Due to this thread, I had a nightmare the other night that I bought a bullpup.

 

[moe mensale]

A fancy new rifle doesn't make up for marksmanship shortfalls.

 

[175FO]

Haven't many other nations switched to a bullpup rifle for their military forces?
Steyr AUG, back in the 1980s.
FAMAS, used by France since the 1970s.
L85, used by the British since the late 1980s.
QBZ-95 or just "Rifle, Type 95" used in China.

The first three of those will most likely be going to an AR type platform. France has already awarded a contract ot HK. The Aussies hate the Steyr and their SOF units use Colt M4s. Their current plans call for replacement of the Steyr by 2022. The L85 is an absolute piece of junk and the Brits want a replacement for that as well.

I would put the chances of the US buying a bullpup at basically zero. The Army wants to field new squad weapons before replacing individual weapons. That will most likely involve a new caliber, which will then guide the individual weapon replacement.

 

[phantoms]

Due to this thread, I had a nightmare fantasy the other night that I bought a bullpup.

ftfy

 

[ed4]

Didn't the Brits buy and bring in H&K to fix the problems with their SA80 bullpup claiming it was the magazines and ammunition causing their failures?