IMO, that would be worth a letter to the department at least trying to point them in the right direction. Whether or not they follow up is up to them, assuming they realize the legal implications of choosing to arrest someone who hasn't committed any crime.
Alarming coversation with local LEO...
Well the other day I had a conversation with a local officer about carry laws. I happen to know him well and he is very pro 2A and a Veteran officer. The subject of alcohol got brought up and he told me that after HB89 the law changed and it did NOT allow you to drink while carrying at all. That they would charge and arrest for it.:shock: I told him that wasn't correct that it only regulates the discharge of a firearm and drinking while hunting. He told me that's what their department taught them after HB89 and that he didn't fully agree with it but that's what their supposed to do. I asked him what they could charge one with and he said Reckless Conduct. I asked even for one beer? Yes :shock: He said it didn't matter that if you had one at home and was later checked for whatever reason and you blow basically anything they could charge you if you where carrying a gun. He then told me that they (his department) my be wrong and in that case you could beat it with a lawyer. He didn't really see a problem with someone who is being a responsible drinker and wasn't drunk. I showed him the code section and he read it and said that he thought they were getting it from the part where it says while hunting etc.. that they where saying that was just a example but again they may be wrong but that's what they was instructed. Again this officer is very pro 2A and this was not his personal opinion but rather the codes of the department he works for. This man knows his stuff and is a very good officer. I don't want this to turn into a LEO bashing. I won't be naming any names. Just wanting to show all to be carful if you drink while armed. Is there any hidden codes on this I missed
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Wasn't it SB308 that removed the restrictions on drinking while carrying? I don't think HB89 had anything to do with that.
to err on the side of caution.. and since I like to drink... I will be securing my peice in my vehicle prior to entering a bar. I dont play well with "gray" areas in the law. Until its locked down to a black or white statute... i wont take the chance
"I was instructed by my department blah, blah, blah" is not an excuse to enforce a non-existent law, especially when the language of the law is known and understood. That's tantamount to an abuse of power. I would find it difficult to hold a law enforcer in positive regard knowing they'd go along with something like that.
Sometimes I wonder if there would be a lot less of this kind of stuff if the "civilians" were a part of review boards that oversaw performance evaluations for promotions/raises and continued employment.
Sometimes I wonder if there would be a lot less of this kind of stuff if the "civilians" were a part of review boards that oversaw performance evaluations for promotions/raises and continued employment.
OP: to cut to the chase here, here's an opinion from a county LEO in that thread...mountainpass said:http://www.georgiapacking.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=50181
legacy38 said:armed and drinking = armed and presently dangerous
It is a very, very easy articulation for anybody that has had to deal with people that have been drinking.
Ya it was SB 308 but he didn't really know which one it was (but hey I forgot too at the time) :shattered:
I've seen MANY LEOs drinking while carrying.
False arrest is your hole card here...I'd absolutely make damn sure that any officer that arrests you on a non-existent charge knows he's flirting with an arrest himself/herself.
False arrest is your hole card here...I'd absolutely make damn sure that any officer that arrests you on a non-existent charge knows he's flirting with an arrest himself/herself.
HB89 made it legal to carry in a restaurant that serves alcohol, but it also made it illegal to drink there with your firearm.
SB308 removed the restriction on drinking in restaurants while carrying, and allows you to carry in bars that allow carry (and drink there).
It sounds like the officer's department needs a SB308 class.
SB308 removed the restriction on drinking in restaurants while carrying, and allows you to carry in bars that allow carry (and drink there).
It sounds like the officer's department needs a SB308 class.
I plan on talking to him again soon about this subject and see if I can convince him that its not correct. Then he might even be able to get something done about it, as this is a fairly small department. But what's the chances of me calling and asking what the policy is and getting a answer? Just to make sure before I write a letter.
You may be right about them not being up-to-date on 308! He is the one that named HB89! Ill bring that up and maybe print it out. Can. Someone post a link to both 89 and 308 that I can print out?
You may be right about them not being up-to-date on 308! He is the one that named HB89! Ill bring that up and maybe print it out. Can. Someone post a link to both 89 and 308 that I can print out?
I seem to recall that this quote was in the context of securing a firearm during an investigation, not in the context of justification for arrest.AV8R said:OP: to cut to the chase here, here's an opinion from a county LEO in that thread...mountainpass said:http://www.georgiapacking.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=50181
legacy38 said:armed and drinking = armed and presently dangerous
It is a very, very easy articulation for anybody that has had to deal with people that have been drinking.
Chip, second post, page 4: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=50181&start=60ChipM said:I seem to recall that this quote was in the context of securing a firearm during an investigation, not in the context of justification for arrest.AV8R said:OP: to cut to the chase here, here's an opinion from a county LEO in that thread...mountainpass said:http://www.georgiapacking.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=50181
legacy38 said:armed and drinking = armed and presently dangerous
It is a very, very easy articulation for anybody that has had to deal with people that have been drinking.
Nevermind... I remembered wrong. :?
There have been times in the past when I would have suggested the LEO contact Legacy or Sheriff "O" for guidance. This is definitely not one of them!
That is correct. SB308 allowed a person to enter a bar, and drink alcohol while carrying a gun, IF you have the bar owner's permission to carry inside of his/her bar and drink.
Also, SB308 allowed a person to enter a restaurant, without the written expressed consent of the owner, and sit down and have a drink with dinner. Its all legal now.
Some officers have stated on this forum that they consider drinking and armed to be armed and dangerous. This is a grey area, as an argument can be made for both sides.
Also, there is something to be said about the wisdom to open carry into a bar. Also, there is something to be said about the wisdom to walk into a bar full of highly intoxicated alpha male types, some of who are drunken :3hat: Ya'll be careful out there.
Also, SB308 allowed a person to enter a restaurant, without the written expressed consent of the owner, and sit down and have a drink with dinner. Its all legal now.
Some officers have stated on this forum that they consider drinking and armed to be armed and dangerous. This is a grey area, as an argument can be made for both sides.
Also, there is something to be said about the wisdom to open carry into a bar. Also, there is something to be said about the wisdom to walk into a bar full of highly intoxicated alpha male types, some of who are drunken :3hat: Ya'll be careful out there.
HB89SASQUATCH said:Can. Someone post a link to both 89 and 308 that I can print out?
http://www1.legis.ga.gov/legis/2007_08/sum/hb89.htm
SB308
http://www1.legis.ga.gov/legis/2009_10/sum/sb308.htm
ehhh.. Doesn't matter how much an officer or LEA thinks its not safe to carry while having a drink, thats not for them to determine. Doesn't matter how great of an LEO you may be, uphold the ACTUAL LAW. Don't go making stuff up, or creating your own interpetation of the law when its clearly in ink stating the law. I respect SO and Legacy a lot, but your personal opinion and the law should be two seperate things, and personal opinion should be kept out of law enforcement. Just enforce the law!! Nothing more nothing less, just the law. And to the OP you do what you feel is right in this matter. Feel free to request a copy of their departments andling of such matters. Feel free to correct them if they say anything other than what 308 states. It's that simple.
This.TippinTaco said:ehhh.. Doesn't matter how much an officer or LEA thinks its not safe to carry while having a drink, thats not for them to determine. Doesn't matter how great of an LEO you may be, uphold the ACTUAL LAW. Don't go making stuff up, or creating your own interpetation of the law when its clearly in ink stating the law. I respect SO and Legacy a lot, but your personal opinion and the law should be two seperate things, and personal opinion should be kept out of law enforcement. Just enforce the law!! Nothing more nothing less, just the law. And to the OP you do what you feel is right in this matter. Feel free to request a copy of their departments andling of such matters. Feel free to correct them if they say anything other than what 308 states. It's that simple.
Am I just crazy(totally plausible), but does have to ask for permission to carry in a bar sound rather stupid? I mean, I do not have to ask permission for any other type of business, which is a good thing. I should not have to call attention to the fact that I am carrying, unless, God forbid, I am forced to use deadly force.
I can understand if I am going to a bar to get drunk, in which case a person should not be armed, or should give up his or her firearm to a GWCL'ed designated driver, or other, sober, trustworthy friend. What makes a bar a sacred plot of land?
If a bar owner, or any other building and/or landowner wishes me not to carry, then I will gladly leave and take my money with me. Signs carry no weight in this State, but bar owner's thoughts do? This portion of the law sounds about as intelligent as the old discharging a firearm on Sunday law was(before it was repealed).
I can understand if I am going to a bar to get drunk, in which case a person should not be armed, or should give up his or her firearm to a GWCL'ed designated driver, or other, sober, trustworthy friend. What makes a bar a sacred plot of land?
If a bar owner, or any other building and/or landowner wishes me not to carry, then I will gladly leave and take my money with me. Signs carry no weight in this State, but bar owner's thoughts do? This portion of the law sounds about as intelligent as the old discharging a firearm on Sunday law was(before it was repealed).
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