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Re: Forget the Second

gunsmoker said:
Let's pretend the 2nd Amendment was repealed and we had the freedom to write a new gun control policy / gun right policy from scratch.
But you are argueing that without the second ammendment, our rights wouldn't exist. The fact is peoples' right to keep adn bear arms is a natural right, not granted by the Constitution, just recognized and protected. If the second ammendment was repealed, it would have no more effect on our rights than the repeal of the first ammendment would mean that all of the sudden the government could tell you what religious beliefs you must hold.
 

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Discussion Starter #82
Yawn.

If you want the legal system to respect your rights and use the power of the courts and law enforcement to uphold your rights, then your rights had better be written down somewhere in a legal document.

If your rights are God-given and inherent to your status as a human being on Earth, then good luck enlisting God's help (or Mother Nature, or the Great Spirit, or whatever other entity runs things in your world view) in preserving those rights.

I say that if we repeal the First Amendment for the express purpose of making Christianity the official religion of the USA, we can do it. It's within our power to do it. I don't want to do it, but it's possible, through the amendment process. (This is a much more honest approach than the atheist's tactic of removing religion from public life through a series of court rulings).
 

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Subject "Yawn"?

Using your argument, the country we live in today wouldn't exist.

The founding fathers knew there were certain rights of humanity that can not be legislated - hence the unalienable rights we so commonly refer to. You can not separate them from a person without taking their life.
 

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Discussion Starter #84
Can't Argue

Well, I'm saying your rights are not absolute, and they are subject to limitations for the common good.

You are saying your rights are absolute, and they are natural rights that were not given by government and therefore cannot by limited by government.

I say...... yeah right, what-ever. You can protest the illegality of the National Firarms Act all you want, but when they haul you off to prison, your argument will get you nowhere. You can argue with the wall if you want to, but you can't dispute the fact that if the U.S. constitution is changed (or interpreted by the Court) to allow for banning guns, and if legislation implementing that ban is passed at federal and / or state levels, that's all it will take.
 

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Re: Can't Argue

gunsmoker said:
Well, I'm saying your rights are not absolute, and they are subject to limitations for the common good.

You are saying your rights are absolute, and they are natural rights that were not given by government and therefore cannot by limited by government.

I say...... yeah right, what-ever. You can protest the illegality of the National Firarms Act all you want, but when they haul you off to prison, your argument will get you nowhere. You can argue with the wall if you want to, but you can't dispute the fact that if the U.S. constitution is changed (or interpreted by the Court) to allow for banning guns, and if legislation implementing that ban is passed at federal and / or state levels, that's all it will take.
With every other "right" you would have a decent arguement, but if the gov't tried to remove the right to bear arms through interpretation then a lot of gun owners would protest WITH their guns... I know I would... that's why the 2nd Amendment is there; to keep the gov't in it's place and prevent tyranny.

right :?:
 
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