Air Force Veteran, Killed While Defending Kids

Discussion in 'In the News' started by Xiclotl, Sep 30, 2010.

  1. Xiclotl

    Xiclotl Active Member

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    http://www.truecrimereport.com/2010/09/ ... eteran.php

    Why did this 69yo old man need to bring a gun with him to yell at a 14yo skateboarder? Must be a tough suburb.

    So why'd it take 2 days to arrest the guy?
     
  2. moga

    moga New Member

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    Hey. Look at the elderly gentlemen that was just beaten by a 14 and 11 y/o here in metro Atlanta. Kids that age can be very strong and rather large and, as the former story demonstrates, vicious as a badger. Tough hood? Heck yea. But in this case, I think the murderer grabbed the gun to make himself appear more menacing to what sounds like a polite and considerate teenager.

    Manslaughter, though? That seems to be a travesty of justice. I'm sure if any of us knew the local politics of the area in which the charge was made, it would probably make a lot more sense. There sure seems to be some politics at play.
     

  3. Bkite

    Bkite PawPaw x 3

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    So, according to this, the guy was open carrying...wonder what the carry laws are there...did this happen in Fla.?
    Dooley was leaving when "David yelled after him about the gun"...did this scare the old man? What did David "yell after him"..."I'll kill you you old m%^#@# f#@$%!" or "Hey thats a nice gun you have there"...
    It sounds like author either didn't know enough about story to write it; he purposefully left out crucial details; or, worse he is absolutely against the 2nd and/or old men with sphincter problems...sad situation either way
     
  4. moga

    moga New Member

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    I'll tell you: FL is strictly a concealed carry state. And they have very strict provisions against a CWP holder pulling a gun to elevate themselves in a non-life-threatening confrontation.
     
  5. moga

    moga New Member

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    http://www.parkrapidsenterprise.com/eve ... /id/25405/
     
  6. Suburbbus

    Suburbbus Well-Known Member

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    You should have added the previous sentence to your quote.
    I agree that the shooter should not have had a gun, but according to this article, he was leaving when David noticed the gun and yelled at him about it.

    There was no threat from the gun at that time, the original incident appeared to be over since Dooley was in the process of leaving the scene.

    Needless loss of life.

    The way this article was written, I wonder how truthful it really is about the sequence of events.
     
  7. moga

    moga New Member

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    http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story.as ... 72&catid=8

    It's probably not going to come out until trial what really happened on that bball court. The accounts vary widely from source to source.
     
  8. moga

    moga New Member

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    Revisiting my earlier comments, I may have spoken out of turn. If the deceased indeed jumped on the bus driver at the mere sight of a secured weapon on his person and a struggle ensued to disarm the carrier of his weapon, subsequently resulting in the deceased being shot unintentionally, then I guess manslaughter would be the right charge. It would be up to a jury to decide whether the carrier is guilty. Being that he's the aggressor in the situation, I'm not surprised that he was eventually charged. It almost seems like the initial responding LE agency had trouble navigating the circumstances to decide whether his conduct is an arrestable offense due to his CWP and florida self-defense law.

    Now, hadn't he been the aggressor, I'm sure from a legal standpoint it would have been a different matter altogether.
     
  9. rmodel65

    rmodel65 Yukon Cornelius

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    not true depends on if they were say at the beach and the man was going fishing or out camping etc and back and forth and while at numerous different events...
     
  10. moga

    moga New Member

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    Florida Statutes Title XLVI, Chapter 790:

    790.053

    Open carrying of weapons.
    —
    (1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device.
    (2) A person may openly carry, for purposes of lawful self-defense:
    (a) A self-defense chemical spray.
    (b) A nonlethal stun gun or dart-firing stun gun or other nonlethal electric weapon or device that is designed solely for defensive purposes.
    (3) Any person violating this section commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
     
  11. rmodel65

    rmodel65 Yukon Cornelius

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    thats not the whole law...in general there is no OC....but there are numerous exceptions
     
  12. rmodel65

    rmodel65 Yukon Cornelius

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    790.25

    Lawful ownership, possession, and use of firearms and other weapons.
    —
    (1)

    DECLARATION OF POLICY.—The Legislature finds as a matter of public policy and fact that it is necessary to promote firearms safety and to curb and prevent the use of firearms and other weapons in crime and by incompetent persons without prohibiting the lawful use in defense of life, home, and property, and the use by United States or state military organizations, and as otherwise now authorized by law, including the right to use and own firearms for target practice and marksmanship on target practice ranges or other lawful places, and lawful hunting and other lawful purposes.
    (2)

    USES NOT AUTHORIZED.—
    (a)

    This section does not authorize carrying a concealed weapon without a permit, as prohibited by ss. 790.01 and 790.02.
    (b)

    The protections of this section do not apply to the following:
    1.

    A person who has been adjudged mentally incompetent, who is addicted to the use of narcotics or any similar drug, or who is a habitual or chronic alcoholic, or a person using weapons or firearms in violation of ss. 790.07-790.115, 790.145-790.19, 790.22-790.24;
    2.

    Vagrants and other undesirable persons as defined in 1s. 856.02;
    3.

    A person in or about a place of nuisance as defined in s. 823.05, unless such person is there for law enforcement or some other lawful purpose.
    (3)

    LAWFUL USES.—The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
    (a)

    Members of the Militia, National Guard, Florida State Defense Force, Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, Coast Guard, organized reserves, and other armed forces of the state and of the United States, when on duty, when training or preparing themselves for military duty, or while subject to recall or mobilization;
    (b)

    Citizens of this state subject to duty in the Armed Forces under s. 2, Art. X of the State Constitution, under chapters 250 and 251, and under federal laws, when on duty or when training or preparing themselves for military duty;
    (c)

    Persons carrying out or training for emergency management duties under chapter 252;
    (d)

    Sheriffs, marshals, prison or jail wardens, police officers, Florida highway patrol officers, game wardens, revenue officers, forest officials, special officers appointed under the provisions of chapter 354, and other peace and law enforcement officers and their deputies and assistants and full-time paid peace officers of other states and of the Federal Government who are carrying out official duties while in this state;
    (e)

    Officers or employees of the state or United States duly authorized to carry a concealed weapon;
    (f)

    Guards or messengers of common carriers, express companies, armored car carriers, mail carriers, banks, and other financial institutions, while actually employed in and about the shipment, transportation, or delivery of any money, treasure, bullion, bonds, or other thing of value within this state;
    (g)

    Regularly enrolled members of any organization duly authorized to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state, or regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for target, skeet, or trap shooting, while at or going to or from shooting practice; or regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for modern or antique firearms collecting, while such members are at or going to or from their collectors’ gun shows, conventions, or exhibits;
    (h)

    A person engaged in fishing, camping, or lawful hunting or going to or returning from a fishing, camping, or lawful hunting expedition;
    (i)

    A pers
    on engaged in the business of manufacturing, repairing, or dealing in firearms, or the agent or representative of any such person while engaged in the lawful course of such business;
    (j)

    A person firing weapons for testing or target practice under safe conditions and in a safe place not prohibited by law or going to or from such place;
    (k)

    A person firing weapons in a safe and secure indoor range for testing and target practice;
    (l)

    A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person’s manual possession;
    (m)

    A person while carrying a pistol unloaded and in a secure wrapper, concealed or otherwise, from the place of purchase to his or her home or place of business or to a place of repair or back to his or her home or place of business;
    (n)

    A person possessing arms at his or her home or place of business;
    (o)

    Investigators employed by the several public defenders of the state, while actually carrying out official duties, provided such investigators:
    1.

    Are employed full time;
    2.

    Meet the official training standards for firearms established by the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission as provided in s. 943.12(5) and the requirements of ss. 493.6108(1)(a) and 943.13(1)-(4); and
    3.

    Are individually designated by an affidavit of consent signed by the employing public defender and filed with the clerk of the circuit court in the county in which the employing public defender resides.
    (p)

    Investigators employed by the capital collateral regional counsel, while actually carrying out official duties, provided such investigators:
    1.

    Are employed full time;
    2.

    Meet the official training standards for firearms as established by the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission as provided in s. 943.12(1) and the requirements of ss. 493.6108(1)(a) and 943.13(1)-(4); and
    3.

    Are individually designated by an affidavit of consent signed by the capital collateral regional counsel and filed with the clerk of the circuit court in the county in which the investigator is headquartered.
    (4)

    CONSTRUCTION.—This act shall be liberally construed to carry out the declaration of policy herein and in favor of the constitutional right to keep and bear arms for lawful purposes. This act is supplemental and additional to existing rights to bear arms now guaranteed by law and decisions of the courts of Florida, and nothing herein shall impair or diminish any of such rights. This act shall supersede any law, ordinance, or regulation in conflict herewith.
    (5)

    POSSESSION IN PRIVATE CONVEYANCE.—Notwithstanding subsection (2), it is lawful and is not a violation of s. 790.01 for a person 18 years of age or older to possess a concealed firearm or other weapon for self-defense or other lawful purpose within the interior of a private conveyance, without a license, if the firearm or other weapon is securely encased or is otherwise not readily accessible for immediate use. Nothing herein contained prohibits the carrying of a legal firearm other than a handgun anywhere in a private conveyance when such firearm is being carried for a lawful use. Nothing herein contained shall be construed to authorize the carrying of a concealed firearm or other weapon on the person. This subsection shall be liberally construed in favor of the lawful use, ownership, and possession of firearms and other weapons, including lawful self-defense as provided in s. 776.012.
    History.
    —

    s. 1, ch. 65-410; s. 32, ch. 69-216; s. 32, ch. 73-334; s. 2, ch. 77-302; s. 2, ch. 82-131; s. 15, ch. 83-167; ss. 45, 49, ch. 83-334; s. 32, ch. 84-258; s. 68, ch. 85-62; s. 5, ch. 85-332; s. 15, ch. 87-274; s. 2, ch. 87-537; s. 1, ch. 89-60; s. 8, ch. 90-364; s. 1, ch. 93-269; s. 7, ch. 93-416; s. 89, ch. 95-211; s. 1218, ch. 97-102; s. 110, ch. 2006-1; s. 2, ch. 2006-103.
    1
    Note.
    —

    Repealed by s. 3, ch. 72-133.
     
  13. moga

    moga New Member

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    Yes, I found it on my own. Subsection (h) of 790.25 doesn't exactly qualify as numerous exceptions in my book, but ok.

    Bkite: unless you are hunting, fishing, or camping; neither of which Dooley was doing from his front porch while watching the activity on the nearby bball court, FL is a strict concealed-carry only state. There.
     
  14. rmodel65

    rmodel65 Yukon Cornelius

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    there are more you gotta keep reading before and after....when your goign to say an appleseed shoot etc you can OC to and from while at and other places to and from