2017 National Concealed Carry Reciprocity H.R. 38

27806 Views 297 Replies 48 Participants Last post by Phil1979, Mar 1, 2018

tmoore912

Discussion Starter · Jan 4, 2017 (Edited)

GOP Rep Introduces National Concealed Carry Reciprocity (H.R. 38) on Day One of New Congress

https://t.co/Ewy0oldY70

"Rep. Hudsonâ€™s bill, which is supported by major pro-Second Amendment groups, would allow people with a state-issued concealed carry license or permit to conceal a handgun in any other state that allows concealed carry, as long as the permit holder follows the laws of that state. It also allows residents of Constitutional carry states the ability to carry in other states that recognize their own residentâ€™s right to concealed carry."

ETA: Rep. Hudson Introduces National Concealed Carry Reciprocity Bill
BY: Stephen Gutowski

http://freebeacon.com/issues/rep-hudson-introduces-national-concealed-carry-reciprocity-bill/

Hudsonâ€™s bill would require states to recognize the validity of every other stateâ€™s gun carry licenses, but it would require concealed carriers to follow the specific laws of whatever state in which they are carrying. The bill mostly mirrors national reciprocity bills introduced by Hudson in previous years but adds language designed to ensure that those in Constitutional Carry states, where no permit is required to concealed carry, are protected by the legislation. The bill would also allow concealed carry in the National Park System, the National Wildlife Refuge System, and on lands under the authority of the Bureau of Land Management, Army Corps of Engineers, and Bureau of Reclamation.

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gunsmoker

· #2 · Jan 4, 2017

How this bill would handle "constitutional carry" states--- ones that don't issue carry permits but just let anybody carry, no questions asked:

QUOTE: "...the â€œidentification documentâ€ in possession of a resident of a constitutional carry state would serve as a permit to carry without a license in other states."

Now, I haven't read the bill, but I wonder:

What's the constitutional authority for the feds to mandate this?

Congress is clearly interfering with the traditional "police power" of states to pass laws concerning the health, welfare, and safety of their local citizens.

I think this bill should only apply for a certain time period of a few weeks, maybe 60 days tops, and it should reference the interstate commerce clause.

If you're traveling into or through another state for business or pleasure, vacation or shopping or attending a business conference-- whatever-- you're engaged in interstate commerce and thus the feds can demand that every state you enter give you reasonable accommodation as to recognizing permits and licenses you hold in your home state.

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AtlPhilip

· #3 · Jan 4, 2017

I think the interstate commerce clause has been bastardized quite enough already.

Wegahe

· #4 · Jan 4, 2017

AtlPhilip said:
I think the interstate commerce clause has been bastardized quite enough already.

I agree completely. So I think it's time to use it for he benefit of us citizens instead of to our detriment for a change.

UtiPossidetis

· #5 · Jan 4, 2017

What is the legal basis for drivers license reciprocity?

68908

· #6 · Jan 4, 2017

The Constitution has no inherent authority or obligation. It has no authority or obligation at all, unless as a contract between man and man. And it does not so much as even purport to be a contract between persons now existing. It purports, at most, to be only a contract between persons living eighty years ago. [This essay was written in 1869.]

But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain â€" that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.

https://www.libertarianism.org/publications/essays/constitution-no-authority

Truth is no such bill should be needed, and any man not imprisoned should legally be able to carry any firearm into any State he pleases. With that said, I hope for the sake of us peasant slaves that it passes and we're allowed to carry everywhere.

68908

· #7 · Jan 4, 2017

Wegahe said:
I agree completely. So I think it's time to use it for he benefit of us citizens instead of to our detriment for a change.

That's some anarchy for you

68908

· #8 · Jan 4, 2017

UtiPossidetis said:
What is the legal basis for drivers license reciprocity?

That's an excellent question.

Feral

· #9 · Jan 4, 2017

I'm glad it was introduced but I don't have high hopes. Every state with draconian laws will fight this tooth and nail.

Malum Prohibitum

· #10 · Jan 4, 2017 (Edited)

gunsmoker said:
What's the constitutional authority for the feds to mandate this?

Fourteenth Amendment privileges and immunities clause, although I doubt Congress is using it.
READ: http://www.guncite.com/journals/senhal14.html
Very good article full of stuff many of you do not know. The time spent reading this article will be more beneficial to those of you reading than similar time spend on GPDO.

Congress is clearly interfering with the traditional "police power" of states to pass laws concerning the health, welfare, and safety of their local citizens.

Yes, as it must do when any state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States.

This is Congress' duty.

I think this bill should only apply for a certain time period of a few weeks, maybe 60 days tops, and it should reference the interstate commerce clause.

The power to regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes?
What if my carrying a gun has no connection to anything commercial? What if I am hiking through with all my provisions on my back, and bearing a gun?

Wickard v. Filburn is a monstrosity. I do not accept Roosevelt's new vision for America, in which he threatened the Surpreme Court to unleash his power from the constraints of the pesky constitution.

The "Commerce Clause" is nothing more than the power to regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes, just as it says. Please stop perverting it into being an excuse for exercising ever more unlimited power.

As for your opinion on limiting the time, well, write your Congressman to limit this provision, which is already far more limited than I think it should be, but I ask you this - what if my hike takes me 61 days? Are you ok with men with tasers and batons and guns dragging me away to a concrete box and keeping me there against my will for a couple of years as punishment? If so, why? If not, why not?

If you're traveling into or through another state for business or pleasure, vacation or shopping or attending a business conference-- whatever-- you're engaged in interstate commerce and thus the feds can demand that every state you enter give you reasonable accommodation as to recognizing permits and licenses you hold in your home state.

What, again, if my journey has nothing to do with commerce?

Anyway, regulations regarding police power are basically the one thing that is NOT an exercise of the commerce clause power. See US. v. Lopez (1995). I think you are headed down an incorrect path.

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mrhutch

· #11 · Jan 4, 2017

Feral said:
I'm glad it was introduced but I don't have high hopes. Every state with draconian laws will fight this tooth and nail.

The federal government already bans pot, and all the states that will kick and scream about reciprocity already passed bills legalizing it. If they don't pay attention to the feds about pot, what makes anyone think they'll pay attention about guns? They already ignore the 2nd amendment to begin with.

Malum Prohibitum

· #12 · Jan 4, 2017

AtlPhilip said:
I think the interstate commerce clause has been bastardized quite enough already.

Somebody can read!

Malum Prohibitum

· #13 · Jan 4, 2017

UtiPossidetis said:
What is the legal basis for drivers license reciprocity?

There is not one.

Malum Prohibitum

· #14 · Jan 4, 2017

Feral said:
I'm glad it was introduced but I don't have high hopes. Every state with draconian laws will fight this tooth and nail.

Will New Jersey have that much sway in a Republican Congress that knows they will have a President now who probably will not exercise the veto over this bill?

moe mensale

· #15 · Jan 4, 2017

UtiPossidetis said:
What is the legal basis for drivers license reciprocity?

How about this?

US Constitution, Article 4, Section 1.

Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof.

IF this is the actual basis for DL reciprocity, why shouldn't it be the basis for firearms/weapons license reciprocity?

mrhutch

· #16 · Jan 4, 2017

gunsmoker said:
How this bill would handle "constitutional carry" states--- ones that don't issue carry permits but just let anybody carry, no questions asked:

QUOTE: "...the â€œidentification documentâ€ in possession of a resident of a constitutional carry state would serve as a permit to carry without a license in other states."

Now, I haven't read the bill, but I wonder:

What's the constitutional authority for the feds to mandate this?

Congress is clearly interfering with the traditional "police power" of states to pass laws concerning the health, welfare, and safety of their local citizens.

I think this bill should only apply for a certain time period of a few weeks, maybe 60 days tops, and it should reference the interstate commerce clause.

If you're traveling into or through another state for business or pleasure, vacation or shopping or attending a business conference-- whatever-- you're engaged in interstate commerce and thus the feds can demand that every state you enter give you reasonable accommodation as to recognizing permits and licenses you hold in your home state.

The constitution should have already overridden any state regulation of firearms with the 2nd amendment. The bill of rights is not a starting point, but a be all end all cap on power. Every state that regulates firearms, including the feds, is already violating the constitution. States have no authority to regulate rights. The rights are there to tell them where their authority ends.

Malum Prohibitum

· #17 · Jan 4, 2017

mrhutch said:
The federal government already bans pot, and all the states that will kick and scream about reciprocity already passed bills legalizing it. If they don't pay attention to the feds about pot, what makes anyone think they'll pay attention about guns? They already ignore the 2nd amendment to begin with.

mrhutch, read the bill. It does not depend upon states "paying attention about guns." Read it and answer your own question.

AtlPhilip

· #18 · Jan 4, 2017

Wegahe said:
I agree completely. So I think it's time to use it for he benefit of us citizens instead of to our detriment for a change.

One does not condemn behavior by repeating it.

Malum Prohibitum

· #19 · Jan 4, 2017

moe mensale said:
How about this?

US Constitution, Article 4, Section 1.

Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof.

Click to expand...

IF this is the actual basis for DL reciprocity, why shouldn't it be the basis for firearms/weapons license reciprocity?

Well, answer a question (or three).

Is a drivers license a public act?

Is a drivers license a record (and if so, of what)?

Is a drivers license a judicial proceeding?

If the answer to all of those questions is no, then you have your answer. If the answer to any is maybe or yes, then you should examine it further, looking at the meaning of each word as it would have been understood in the 1790s.

Malum Prohibitum

· #20 · Jan 4, 2017

How many of you have read the bill?

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